Reptile & Amphibian Forums

i read on chondroweb forum,about 3 weeks ago, a post about a guy hatching his first clutch ever.he was great with daily updates and photos and everyone really was great with advise ect.anyway,he said that he was really sloppy and although the past 2 years he has tried to do things right and cycle,he has had no luck.then,while keeping his pair together and he said he intended on cycling and watching temps,he just got busy and sloppy and really did nothing other than let them live together.long story short,he now has babies.it got me thinking on exactly how important cycling is and if its common to have success like this with basically doing nothing other than introduce a pair.the reason i am asking this is,i dont own a female.i am currently cycling my male and a friend of mine is cycling his female but i have doubts as to how serious he is taking this.if only one of us where to be cycling properly,would there be a better chance is the male was being cycled or the female??where is the proplem most encountered??the female not being receptive? or the male not being interested??

Cycling the snakes has been proven to increase the percentage of having a successfull clutch... If my memory serves, Aaron said he was cycling, but he wasent watching it close...
i have no idea what goes on in a snakes head, but i think that if proper cycling is done and the snakes dont breed it is probably just because they are not in the mood... Cycling is done because according to some experts those are the common breeding temps in PNG... but just because they are cycled does not mean they are going to breed... in the wild they dont have people watching them through the cage ect... it all boils down to the snakes, i know people that swear both way is the best and i respect both opinions... it probably has alot to do with the enclosure ect that they are in as to whether it will work or not...

Shiloh
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Shiloh Hawkesworth
kansas
(Midwest Serpents)

what are the both ways youre talking about? cycling and not cycling>?? im just curious because greg maxwell says that temp cycling is the most popular way of initiating change and change is what triggers a breeding responce.what other forms of change can one use?how about humidity/misting??i know several species of reptile and amphibians can be coaxed into breeding by several days or weeks of heavy misting.this is supposed to simulate the rainy season.not saying it can work in chondros but im assuming there must be another way since greg said what he said.

yes i have heard both ways, cycling and not cycling... personally i think that cycling should be tried first, i mean if your going to do it you will probably get the best results by using the more common method...
i have also heard that some people use too low of a cycling temp, because over in PNG it will never get that cold... i actually find it vary intresting how common it is for a chondro to get a RI during cycling, because it that were happening in the wild i dont think their would be too many chondros left... but it all boils down to what works...
in my opinion Aaron probably cycled his Chondros, but dident lower the temp as much as some suggest, and he still had success... maybe i should call him and ask...
i'm going to shut up now and hope that Julian or Rich or Brandon or whoever have something to say about it...

Shiloh
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Shiloh Hawkesworth
kansas
(Midwest Serpents)

With many species, I have heard that the cooler cycling temps are usually necessary for viable and plentiful sperm production.

I'm not sure if, or how, this may apply to the females' reproductive system and production of fertile ova(?), but I imagine it has some bearing and influence, or it wouldn't be done by so many breeders.

Just some thoughts.

Kevin

The first time I bred my chondros was back in '01, I did everything by the book as far as cycling. I was blessed with my first batch of eggs which later hatched and I was a happy camper. Then in '03 I decided to do again, however, this time did not cycle at all. My chondros copulated like crazy for weeks and I firmly believe that the trigger was the shorter amount of daylight shinning in through the windows. Unfortunately, my female layed 18 unfertilized eggs. I still don't know if this was because I didn't cycle or if it would have happened anyway. I posted this question on one of the other forums and not one person replied out of 120 people that read the post. I'm hesitant to try it again since breeding really takes it's toll on the female. I don't have any answers but it may be that cycling is also reqired for successful fertilization....maybe, but myself and the 120 people on that other forum don't know either.------RON

hey ron,thanks for the reply.was the time back in 01 the first time you bred or was the first time you even tried and it was successful?

It was the first time I tried and it worked like a charm. I used maternal incubation. It was before Maxwell's book. The only info I had was the info the guys from NERDS gave me as well as info from Rico Walder. I did it exactly the same way in '03 minus the cycling and it was a complete wash. Wish I knew the cause.---RON

Ron, I am a firm believer that cycling is good for successful fertilization. I tend to take a rather different approach than most "well known" keepers. I keep females cool until I am sure I've witnessed an ovulation, and even then, temps are not raised to extreme ranges that MOST keepers use. I strongly believe higher basking temps will kill sperm stored by the female before ovulation occurs. My temps hover between 68-82 during the entire breeding process until I get eggs. This has worked for me for the last 5 years with excellent success. Good luck.
Brandon Osborne

I appreciate the info!-----RON