Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I would like to get a king snake, but I really dont know the difference between the california, or the mexican etc. Do they all behave more and less the same, or it depends on the king of kingsnake? If so, which one do you recomend for a begginer.I am planning to get a baby one.
Thanks a lot

well,in my opinion-and i have kept almost all species of kings-getulas,mexicanas,alternas,and milks too...sounds like you're asking about just the "common" kingsnake(getula)...if by 'mexican' you meant the lampropeltis mexicana species(a.k.a. thayeri/variable/durango mntn./greeri/mex-mex/san luis potosi...all different names for the same species),i would hold off on this one,though they are attractively colored/patterned...these are not bad as pets at all-just not as good as some common kings for a beginner...as for milks and gray banded kings,avoid those for now...btw there is a mexican black kingsnake-lampropeltis getula nigrita-and,being a getula subspecies,would be fine for a beginner...like their name implies,these are solid jet black,and are great as pets....there is several other common kings-california,desert,speckled,florida,eastern,and black(niger,different from nigrita-usually with some white speckling on their sides)...i've never kept these or the speckleds,but have heard these can sometimes be a touch more difficult(yes,there are always exceptions,remember) than the others...also easterns are sometimes picky eaters as babies,prefering lizards over pinkies.however one formerly valid subspecies-now considered an isolated pattern phase of the eastern-is the goini,a.k.a. blotched king...these have always been great eaters for me.....bottom line,i would go with a california(highly variable patterns to choose from also),goini(also highly variable in appearence),florida,desert,or nigrita(mexican black)....easterns,speckleds,or black(niger) would be probably just fine also,as long as you make sure these are established eaters on rodents.remember of course to buy a captive bred specimen-no need to buy a wild-caught these days...get a baby/young one,again,make sure it's an established eater(i.e. has eaten at least 4-5 meals on it's own)....good luck!p.s. rememebr to keep these guys caged ALONE-they love to eat snakes,be it their own kind, or not.

Personal preference only...I like the nigritas, speckleds, and desert kings. I find them attractive and great feeders. Justinian said it all, make sure it is an established feeder from a reputable dealer and you should enjoy it for years to come. Handle it often and feed it in a seperate container so it will not associate the opening of the cage every time with meals, Though they are usually always ready for a meal, LOL! Good luck!
Todd Hughes

Thanks lot for your reply, I thing I will go for the california that has the orange, with black-white-black stripes.

You are new to snakes? if so...Not such a smart move. California Mt Kings can be very delicate and also expensive. Better to put a hold on your color preferences and go with a Chain Type king that you can learn the basics on.

Frank
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"The luxury of not getting involved departed with the last lifeboat Skipper..."

sorry,i did'nt think to say 'stay away from the 'mountain kings'..lol....there is a sonoran mntn. king(pyromelana) and california mntn. king(an entirely separate species-zonata,not to be confused with the california kingsnake)..these are 'tri-colors'....and like rearfanged said,stay away from these,not for beginners....if you must have an orange or colorful snake,check out some florida or goini kings,or maybe a 'designer' morph(albino) of a cal. king...the rest will be patterned with some combo of black and white or yellow to varying degrees.

I recommend Mexican Black Kings as the best starter kingsnake.

Tim

Third Eye

Totally agree with Tim, The Third Eye! MBK's are easy and cool. Not into jet black, go with splendida, very variable, with yellows or cream patterns(get a sockhead!)Or get a monster florida king, there are some wicked looking morphs with awesome coloration.
Todd Hughes

I will reiterate what the others have said about Mtn Kings, Gray-banded Kings, Mexican (Variable, San Luis Potosi) Kings, and Milksnakes. They are pretty, but can sometimes be a little harder to start. A captive bred gray-band that is well started on unscented pinkies isn't a bad choice, but the common kings are better.

Of course, some common kingsnakes (and even cornsnakes) can be tough until they are securely started on pinkie mice. This is where you have to find a breeder you trust.

As for the common kingsnakes, I would make these comments -

Mexican Black Kingsnake - cheap, reasonable size, docile, good feeders
California Kingsnake - cheap, reasonable size, some are a bit nippy, variety of morphs
Desert Kingsnake - harder to find, reasonable size, docile, good feeders
Speckled Kingsnake - harder to find, reasonable size, somewhat high strung
Eastern Kingsnake - big, rat eating machines. Can get large (6ft) and therefore cost more to house/feed, not easy to find cb babies
Florida Kingsnake - cheap, common, hardy, easy to feed, can get up to 6 feet so more expensive to house and feed
Blotched/Appalachicola Kingsnake - common, attractive, similar in size to the last two ssp.
Eastern Black Kingsnake - uncommon in hobby, some are high strung
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Chris Harrison
Central Texas

Get a variable (thayeri) kingsnake. And I've got a bunch of reasons why.

They have an excellent disposition, never bite, rarely musk, even as babies. Variable kings make the BEST pets in my opinion. They almost seem to enjoy human interaction.

Perfect size. Thayeri rarely get over 3 ft long. Easy to house and feed.

Excellent feeders even as babies. All but one of my 2005 hatchlings fed right away. NEVER buy ANY snake that has not fed or is not feeding well when you purchase it.

Beauty and variability. Thayeri are some of the most beautiful kingsnakes on the market today. And the variety is almost endless.

The only drawback is price.......... kinda/sorta. You can buy most common kingsnakes for between $30-$150. Thayeri run between $45-and $350. Probably a median price of $100.00.

There is one other drawback too. Once you get one you'll want to have more LOL. They really are addictive. Just ask anyone who posts regularly on the Mexicana Forum.

Here's a little variety. The 1st 2 are siblings.

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Vichris

Vichris Variables

I agree with you 110% Chris.....
Nothing is as docile as the Mexicana ssp. And nothing more variable and colorful.
And as for the nonfeeding rubbish....It is just that...RUBBISH

I have had MORE problems getting corns and getula feeding than any of my Mexicana hatchlings......I guess to each his own.
I still have 5 Splendida / Holbrooki intergrades that should have a reputation as bad as those non feeding alterna...And I can get alterna to feed with much more ease than these getula.....Also, I lost 4 corns to nonfeeding this year.....Not a single Mexicana has been lost at all.....To tell you the truth...I have only lost 3 Mexicana hatchlings to nonfeeding over the last 5 or so years.

These all ate.....and are still eating....NO PROBLEM!

And that is my dos centavos..........
John Lassiter

I still really like my Cal kings, greybands, pyros, and desert kings, but none of them hold a candle to the good ole lampropeltis mexicana thayeri.
Like some others that posted here I too have had or have most or a good portion of kingsnakes in the "trade". None of them have hooked me like thayeri.
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Vichris

Vichris Variables

Don't get me wrong I have a ton of getula and some milksnakes as well as a few alterna......The point is snakes are individuals and there will be reluctant feeders in each species or sub species.....It should not be confined to just the Mexicana ssp.

Thanks for the compliment Chris....YOU TOO have some great thayeri.....Bet you can't wait for next year.....
John Lassiter

Good thing I came to this board to defend my corns lol. Look corn snakes are GREAT, ALL species of snake hatchlings sometimes have problems with feeding, everyone is saying corn but the truth is some species of babies just dont want to eat or dont want to eat unless its something they really want, not just corns. I love my hatchling corn, and soon I will get more corns and breed, I love kings to but as for a first snake I went with corns because they have about 60 different morphs. But hey if you like kings go with what the others say as they are more experience with them but dont think corns are inferior and not good for the first time or novice snake owner.Oh yea and the first day I fed my corn hatchling he devoured his pinky without any braining or tempting. I'm sorry I typed all of this but I love my corn and even though he was nippy when I first bought him he is as docile as any king. Yea thats why I had to defend corns lol.

JaysonJ,
I agree...I think a corn has got to be the BEST beginner snake for anyone.
I was just making a point that snakes are individuals and there will be reluctant feeders in every species......I was also "defending" my Mexicana.....LOL
Maybe one day I will get some multi-heterozygous corns for the variability within one clutch.......For now I will stick with good ole Thayeri since hets and morphs are not needed for variability....
John Lassiter

LOL..... Just kidding JJ. Corn snakes are nice snakes. No need to defend them.
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Vichris

Vichris Variables

I was about to have a heart attack Vichris lol. Yea jlassiter you have a nice point there I guess everyone just has a specific snake for them except for snake-o-phobes.

Yeah, well my kingsnake can whup your cornsnake! Just kidding! Not! LOL! Really I have a corn as well as several southern and great plains rats and they are great snakes but this IS the kingsnake forum and i think the question was and always will be what is the best king for a beginner. As was said, awesome thayeri Chris and John, and we all have our opinions. I say get three different kinds raise 'em for a while, see which you like best and give me the losers!
Todd Hughes

I have to agree with ViChris and Jlassister. Thayeri kings are some of the most stunning snakes you can own. And oh by the way, they're dog tame. They are about as non-offensive a snake as you can own. Good feeders on pinkies from the start.
Also at the top of my list are Mexican Milksnakes. Aggressive feeders on rodents, very robust for their size, and pretty darn calm.
For larger snakes, it's hard to beat the getula complex. I'd say Mexican Black kings are as good a choice as any. Very aggressive feeders, most are dog tame, average 3 1/2 to 4 1/2 feet, with some going over 5. My male nigrita is arond 63 inchs.
Corns of course, what more can be said about the worlds most popoular ratsnake. And another ratsnake I'll throw in that's very underrated. The Bairdi Ratsnake. Very hardy ratsnakes that grow about the same size as corns, maybe a little larger on average. Most are very calm.
Steve

Glad you agree Steve.....
I forgot to mention mexican milksnakes.....they are the best all around milksnake to own...very docile and robust.

Here is a male Annulata I found on Jan. 1 of this year....Just 6 days after 8 inches of snow (the most ever here in South Texas) on Christmas Eve / Day. BTW.....It was 80 degrees on Jan. 1.....Gotta love South Texas weather.
John Lassiter
Jim Wells Co, TX Mexmilk

Yes Mexican milksnakes are excellent snakes too. My first purchase of snakes was a pair of sinaloans then a pair of mexican milks. Both are great little milksnakes. I still have my female sinaloan. She's just a nice, mellow, great looking, snake.

But..........I still think thayeri are the way to go.

This one looks alot like a mexican milk.

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Vichris

Vichris Variables

I think the MSP thayeri are some of my favorites, and yours looks better then......a real milksnake, LOL
Believe it or not, as much as I admire these little kings, I don't have any thayeri in my collection....YET!
For now, my huge Grey-band is as close as I have. He's an 03 that is around three foot, maybe a little more. I purchased him as an established rodent eater, (wise on my part), and this guy has never missed a beat. He'd eat in the blue if I let him. Non-locality alterna that came from Mark & Kim Bell.

Steve

Yes Mexican milksnakes are excellent snakes too. My first purchase of snakes was a pair of sinaloans then a pair of mexican milks. Both are great little milksnakes. I still have my female sinaloan. She's just a nice, mellow, great looking, snake.

But..........I still think thayeri are the way to go.

This one looks alot like a mexican milk.

John, that is a beautiful Mexmilk. Just goes to show how hardy they are. Thanks for the pics. Beautiful annulata. I just posted an updated pic of mine on the Milksnake forum.

Steve

Here is a male Annulata I found on Jan. 1 of this year....Just 6 days after 8 inches of snow (the most ever here in South Texas) on Christmas Eve / Day. BTW.....It was 80 degrees on Jan. 1.....Gotta love South Texas weather.
John Lassiter
Jim Wells Co, TX Mexmilk

Yo Steve,
That Axanthic Brooksi should be in this thread!!!! That is one cool snake!!!! Love all the Thayeri!!! I'm hoping for big things from you John L!!!!!!

Pat

Me too!!!
Todd Hughes

AWWWW! NO FAIR! Awesome snakes Vichris! I like 'em too! But you just set her up for an expensive habit! Beware da pusherman! LOL! Just kiddin'! Here's my ugly buckskin male.
Todd Hughes

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