Reptile & Amphibian Forums

JUST WANTED TO SHOW HIM OFF WITH THIS AWSOME SHOT

ENJOY
JUSTIN

Wild....

The scales he does have look like little water droplets on his skin.

Thanks for sharing,

Alan

A snake I can relate too.....bald headed!
I love that sucker!
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RicK @ BbI

Ball Boutique,Inc.
Proud sponsor of this forum

A snake I can relate too.....bald headed!
I love that sucker!
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RicK @ BbI

I know the feeling. The older I get, the more I look like that little guy.

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No snowflake ever falls in the wrong place.

Zen proverb

Snowballs

SNOWBALLS

Hey my dad was bald.....so we are het for derma.
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RicK @ BbI

Ball Boutique,Inc.
Proud sponsor of this forum

Do you think the ladies would buy it?

Hey baby, I am het for Derma wanna dance?
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No snowflake ever falls in the wrong place.

Zen proverb

Snowballs

SNOWBALLS

Hey baby, I am het for Derma wanna dance?

Nah, more like "your termite mound or mine!"
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RicK @ BbI

Ball Boutique,Inc.
Proud sponsor of this forum

WHAT THE HELL IS *THAT*?!?!?!?!
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1.0 alb. okeetee "Grissom"
1.0 American Pit Bull Terrier "Vanyel"
0.1 Somali "Willow"

It's a ball python that doesn't have many scales. Quite neat looking in my book. I suspect it's very soft to touch to
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PHLdyPayne

whats the point?
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1.0 alb. okeetee "Grissom"
1.0 American Pit Bull Terrier "Vanyel"
0.1 Somali "Willow"

you mean where, and its at the end of the snake... it comes to a point.

Ben

. . . . . . . . har har
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1.0 alb. okeetee "Grissom"
1.0 American Pit Bull Terrier "Vanyel"
0.1 Somali "Willow"

AWESOME!!
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J.Jex

i like scales. IMO
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billy jean king
BugBusters

I remember seeing some posts on this on Fauna a few months back. Is JSReptiles the same guy or did you buy them? Just curious.
I think I remember reading about claims for het sibs and stuff...What are the plans on proving these guys out (or what are plans in general)?
Jeremy
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Isn't it cooler that serpent's don't walk anymore?
(Genesis 3:14)

Does it shed just like normal balls, but without the scale texture on the entire snake (just on the spots where there are scales)? Love the look of it btw...

I have never seen anything like that. Pretty neat looking.
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1.1 Classic Jungle
1.0 Pastel
0.2 Classic
1.0 Okeetee Corn
1.1 Butter Corn
0.1 type A anerythristic corn
0.1 Classic corn
0.0.1 babycurus jacksoni

That is an awesome snake. Is it a proven genetic trait?

Does anyone know yet if this is a random mutation or if it is reproducable. I'm guessing it's random but I hope not.
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1.1 Balls (1.0 het clown 0.1 normal)
1.1 Kittys and
0.1 WC Human
"I need evaluation...and dinner; and by dinner I don't meen gnome heads!"

The guy claims to have the mother and that she is also Derma but after amny requests he's not shared any pictures of her so who knows - it's probably just a way for him to get others to pay $30K for a normal sibbling. I am sure if it lives long enough he'll breed the hell out of it.
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Tosha

"Nihil facimus sed id bene facimus"

7.33.0 Ball Python (Harry and Fluffy and gang)
1.0.0 Angolan Python (Anakin Skywalker)
0.0.1 Green Tree Python (Verdi - yeah I know but my kids love the book)
0.2.0 Feline (Pippen and Pandora)
0.0.1 Desert Tortoise (Pope John Paul aka JP )
2.2.1 Fish (1,2,3,4)
0.0.2 frogs rescued from pool skimmer

Yeah, until I see the mom I'm assuming it's a random thing. It's just way too wierd to be genetic. More like the poor thing didn't fully form.
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1.1 Balls (1.0 het clown 0.1 normal)
1.1 Kittys and
0.1 WC Human
"I need evaluation...and dinner; and by dinner I don't meen gnome heads!"

Does anyone know yet if this is a random mutation or if it is reproducable. I'm guessing it's random but I hope not.

So far, for similar looking conditions in other species, all have failed to reproduce, at all. Let alone prove out a genetic.

Eric Thiss had a "scaleless" water snake he spent many years trying to breed. He bred other water snakes but not the scaleless one. Same holds true for Pituophis species produced in the eighties.
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AMAZON REPTILE CENTER

NAMED BEST REPTILE STORE IN LOS ANGELES

Its amazing to me that so many people were raising such hell over this snake just a few months ago, and now its not only being accepted, but theres a bunch of people saying they like it!

I personaly didnt care when it was introduced as i have seen it in other snakes, but would I want it? nope. it has too many scales. I want my skin snake to be all skin. so im vane, what can I say?

Glad to see hes doing well, and thanks for the update!

Its not more accepted - its just not worth bringing up the same debate over and over again - I hate it always will - if it does turn out to be genetic - I hope people keep close records on what they breed those genes into - I would hate for those genes end up in my collection by mistake.
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Tosha

"Nihil facimus sed id bene facimus"

7.33.0 Ball Python (Harry and Fluffy and gang)
1.0.0 Angolan Python (Anakin Skywalker)
0.0.1 Green Tree Python (Verdi - yeah I know but my kids love the book)
0.2.0 Feline (Pippen and Pandora)
0.0.1 Desert Tortoise (Pope John Paul aka JP )
2.2.1 Fish (1,2,3,4)
0.0.2 frogs rescued from pool skimmer

"Its amazing to me that so many people were raising such hell over this snake just a few months ago, and now its not only being accepted, but theres a bunch of people saying they like it!"

When I was reading this this morning I was thinking the same thing. I still don't like the snake, but I see nothen wrong with it either.

"I would hate for those genes end up in my collection by mistake."

I have heard that before, but I got to ask, where are all the het pied, and het albino's that get into people collections by mistake?

What I'm saying is if they breed the snake, and prove it to be genetic, do you realy think he would sell a het, as a normal? I don't. There seem to be people who like it, and I'm sure if hets are ever for sale, they will be sold as hets and not normals.

"I have heard that before, but I got to ask, where are all the het pied, and het albino's that get into people collections by mistake?"

Happens all the time - I - just sold possible het pieds as normals - some people here have been known to give away possibles to petshops. People have picked up things from petshops or imports or otherwise normals and they've held some secret ingredient or another.

And we don't know the genetics on this - it may not rear it ugly head again for several generations by then all the offspring have been sold off as normals or already bred into something else. Genes are not always as cut and dry as some people would like to think.
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Tosha

"Nihil facimus sed id bene facimus"

7.33.0 Ball Python (Harry and Fluffy and gang)
1.0.0 Angolan Python (Anakin Skywalker)
0.0.1 Green Tree Python (Verdi - yeah I know but my kids love the book)
0.2.0 Feline (Pippen and Pandora)
0.0.1 Desert Tortoise (Pope John Paul aka JP )
2.2.1 Fish (1,2,3,4)
0.0.2 frogs rescued from pool skimmer

Why would you sell a possible het as a normal? I can see selling a possible het at a normal price, but you should always sell the animal as what it actually is. What if someone buys a pair from a pet store as normals and produces a morph, all the sudden they think they have a new line of pied or albino, or whatever. I just think it could add to the confusion that you are afraid of.

I'm hoping she meant she sold it at a normal price, and told the person that they might be hets.

Yes they were sold as normals at a normal price - I'd gotten them from a friend thru trade - didn't have paperwork when I sold them and didn't want to be bothered - a lot of people do it - people who aren't so concerned about makeing that extra $25 by taging on the fact that it might carry a gene.
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Tosha

"Nihil facimus sed id bene facimus"

7.33.0 Ball Python (Harry and Fluffy and gang)
1.0.0 Angolan Python (Anakin Skywalker)
0.0.1 Green Tree Python (Verdi - yeah I know but my kids love the book)
0.2.0 Feline (Pippen and Pandora)
0.0.1 Desert Tortoise (Pope John Paul aka JP )
2.2.1 Fish (1,2,3,4)
0.0.2 frogs rescued from pool skimmer

Now I realy have no problem with selling a pos het at a normal price, but to not tell the buyer what they are getting, isn't that looked down on? I mean you did misrepresent the snakes you were selling, not in a bad way(to me, others might see it another way), but misrepresenting is misrepresenting, right?

Infact, wouldn't that mean you did, just what you hope is not done to you?

Anyway I'm not starting anything here, I find your posts to be helpful and don't want you to get the wrong idea.

Like I said I don't like the snake either, and I would not want it in my collection, I guess you just have to trust who get your snakes from to tell you what your getting.

This is the way I look at it - the derma is a birth defect - it's missing its physical parts (scales and heat pits) a pied or other morph are just different colors. That is why I wouldn't want ot have a derma in my collection.

Besides I sold them to people who just wants them as pets - they don't have any intentions of breeding them and were looking for just some nice normals.

Don't worry I'm not offended by your posts - you may be partially right but like I said - there is a big difference between selling something that may produce a snake of a different color and one that may produce a deformity. And before anyone goes there thats why I won't be working with carmels either.
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Tosha

"Nihil facimus sed id bene facimus"

7.33.0 Ball Python (Harry and Fluffy and gang)
1.0.0 Angolan Python (Anakin Skywalker)
0.0.1 Green Tree Python (Verdi - yeah I know but my kids love the book)
0.2.0 Feline (Pippen and Pandora)
0.0.1 Desert Tortoise (Pope John Paul aka JP )
2.2.1 Fish (1,2,3,4)
0.0.2 frogs rescued from pool skimmer

Lets not forget that a different color is a deformity, one a lot of people like, but still a deforminty non the less.

Whoa - not to change the topic or anything, but do caramels really produce a deformity? I've never heard of that and I was considering purchasing one in the future. Thanks for the heads up and anything else you know about it.

"Besides I sold them to people who just wants them as pets - they don't have any intentions of breeding them and were looking for just some nice normals."

Ahh but they may sell these "pets" in the future, and it could be very near with the way many people are in this hobby. I get the deal, it's what the "big boys" do. Most of us don't have the numbers around to make this necessary. In the boa world, this could become a huge issue, especially with locale animals. Many people are crossing hog island boas to hypos. So if the normals from this breeding are just handed off to petstores, they will be labeled as what they look like and future locale projects ARE going to be screwed up....at some point! Contrary to what many of us feel, some people HATE pieds, or ANY morph for that matter. Some may feel they're doing some lucky person a favor if they "hit" on a random pair, but this is just forcing your own opinion on others. From what it sounds like, if you picked up some "normals" and they produced Dermas, you'd be highly upset. So, what I'm saying is-look at things from the point of view of everyone that MAY end up with your passed off as normal poss. hets. Would I complain about it? No, but I wouldn't complain about the Derma either and obviously you would. What gives any of us the right to determine what is good for someone else? Hope this "rant" makes sense to you, it's not an attack by any means. Take care!

Paul

I thought it was cool the instant I saw it, just didn't have an account at the time. I sure hope i get one by accident!
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1.1 Balls (1.0 het clown 0.1 normal)
1.1 Kittys and
0.1 WC Human
"I need evaluation...and dinner; and by dinner I don't meen gnome heads!"

I wouldn't mind getting one by accident either.

I think people get jealous when someone else has something they know they can't have.

Alan

Its not a jealouslsy thing - trust me - I admittedly am jealous of super cinny owners, anyone with more than one Angolan, RDR's collection and Amir's - the Derma is a deformaty not something to be jealous of.
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Tosha

"Nihil facimus sed id bene facimus"

7.33.0 Ball Python (Harry and Fluffy and gang)
1.0.0 Angolan Python (Anakin Skywalker)
0.0.1 Green Tree Python (Verdi - yeah I know but my kids love the book)
0.2.0 Feline (Pippen and Pandora)
0.0.1 Desert Tortoise (Pope John Paul aka JP )
2.2.1 Fish (1,2,3,4)
0.0.2 frogs rescued from pool skimmer

It is no more a deformity than missing a gene that produces melanin.

Besides, what makes you think I was referring to you in my statement?

Relax...

Alan

No stress - I assumed since I was the only one that said I hated the thing and that I wouldn't want those genes accidently getting into my collection then your post at least part of it was in reference to me - that's all.
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Tosha

"Nihil facimus sed id bene facimus"

7.33.0 Ball Python (Harry and Fluffy and gang)
1.0.0 Angolan Python (Anakin Skywalker)
0.0.1 Green Tree Python (Verdi - yeah I know but my kids love the book)
0.2.0 Feline (Pippen and Pandora)
0.0.1 Desert Tortoise (Pope John Paul aka JP )
2.2.1 Fish (1,2,3,4)
0.0.2 frogs rescued from pool skimmer