Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I have a male and female veiled that I paired for the first time this month. The female was initially receptive and they appeared to mate. (You can see some cool photos on my blog here.)
After an hour or so she started showing gravid coloration as well as gaping and generally wanting him out of her cage. A week later I showed the male to the female and she immediately started swaying, gaping and put on her gravid colors again.
My question is; is this a definate sign of a successful mating or is it possible she is just not interested? How likely is it a single mating will produce fertile eggs? She is about 1 1/2 years old and has never laid eggs. He is about 8 months.
I'm interested in anyone's feedback.
Thanks,
-Drew

First...I'm glad to hear that you waited until she was over a year old before you mated her...even if it was only because your male is quite a bit younger than her.

Her behavior/coloration/reaction to the male when you tried to introduce them a week after the first introduction is non-receptive/gravid behavior/coloration.

Since she was never mated before your first introduction, I would expect her to be gravid...however, part/all of the clutch could be infertile or part/all of it could be fertile. There is no real way of knowing where she was in her egg production cycle..so there is no real way of knowing if all the eggs will be fertile or not.

I have had veiled females lay a clutch of infertile eggs quite soon (shorter than the normal 30ish days) after their first-ever mating which I expect is caused by the egg production cycle being too far along for the eggs to be fertilized. If this first clutch is completely infertile, it is usually followed a few weeks (less than the normal 30ish days)later by the laying of a completely fertile clutch.

I have also had females lay a clutch that is partly fertile and partly infertile after the initial mating. Again...I expect it has to do with where in the cycle the female is. This is usually followed by the laying of another partly fertile, partly infertile clutch when the time is right for the next clutch to be laid.

All this to say...nothing is written in stone!
(BTW...I didn't look at your photos.)

A few comments on the whole process of laying eggs....
Don't let the female see you looking at her when she is digging the hole for the eggs or she could abandon the hole. If she abandons the digging often enough, she could become eggbound.

Provide her with a proper egglaying site (now) so that she has a place to dig when she is ready.

I always let my females finish burying the eggs before I remove the eggs from the container.

Its wise to have the container you are going to incubate the eggs in ready before she lays the eggs. I have always used vermiculite to incubate the eggs in...moistened so that no/very little water can be squeezed out of a handful of it. I incubate them at about 80F. The reason I say "about" is that the temperature fluctuates in my incubation set-up during the 24hour schedule. I have also always left some space (approx. 1" between the eggs when I place them in the incubation container because I find they don't hatch all at once this way and I feel that I have a better survival rate this way.

Good luck!
If you have any other questions, I will do my best to answer them.

Thanks for the great reply. You answered a couple questions and reaffirmed some assumptions I've been making.
I have her in a cage w/ a container of sand in the bottom. (Is there a reason not to just keep the female in this setup all the time? I was a little worried she would need to lay before I could mate her and so she's been in the 'laying' cage for several months.)
I am assembling the supplies for the eggs once she lays. How do you cycle the heat for the eggs? Do you put them in an incubator and adjust the temp or control the ambient temp of the room?
Thanks again for the helpful reply.
-Drew

You're welcome!

You said..."Is there a reason not to just keep the female in this setup all the time?"...Its just a matter of her being satisfied with the laying place. I have had some veiled females that are quite satisfied to lay their eggs in the container in the cage. Some of them don't seem satisfied with that small of a container, so I would move them to the large one where they usually completed the egglaying. (I say "usually" because I have had the odd one that ended up being moved back to her cage where she then decided that the smaller container was satisfactory after all.) One thing I do try NOT to do is to move them back and forth.

You said..."I was a little worried she would need to lay before I could mate her"...it is hard to know if/when they are going to lay eggs when they haven't been mated. Experience is the best teacher in that area....but even then there are times when you might not be sure! Having an area in the cage for egglayers saves having to figure it out!

You said..."How do you cycle the heat for the eggs? Do you put them in an incubator and adjust the temp or control the ambient temp of the room?"...I don't use an incubator. I've been hatching chameleon eggs since the mid '90's....and didn't have an incubator when I started. I have my own "creation" that I use to incubate eggs and its been very successful for most of the types of eggs that I have had to use heat for....so I never changed it. It consists of a people's heating pad over which a wooden and screen form is placed. I can set the heat and raise and lower the screen/wood form to attain the right temperature in the egg containers...primative...but I have almost 100% hatch rate with veileds using it. Because the whole thing is not enclosed in a cupboard or such and I don't adjust the temperature of the heating pad, the room temperature plays a part in the incubation process. The eggs cool slightly at night and get slightly warmer during the day. The biggest problem that I have encountered with this setup is that the summer temperatures can push the temperature too high once in a while, even when the heating pad is turned off. (The area is in total darkness though, since its in the basement. I don't know if light would bother the eggs or not.)

I use a lidded tupperwaree-type container (about 15x8x3"deep) that has been filled about half way full of moistened vermiculite. I place the eggs in the container in rows spaced about an inch apart in all directions. I poke about 6 very small holes in the lid and place the lid on the container after the eggs are in it. I place the container on the screen over the heating pad. (Moisture will collect on the sides of the container.) If the eggs are fertile, they will start to grow. If they are infertile, they will be slightly smaller when laid and not as white looking as fertile ones. (I realize this isn't very helpful if you've never seen eggs before.)

Hope this helps! Good luck with it all! (It can be very hard on the nerves!)