Reptile & Amphibian Forums

hello all
i have been looking around the fourms for a while. i have two kingsnakes and am looking into getting a ball python for my wife. first question i have is when useing a bulb for heat can you use a regular bulb like a 40 or 60watt blub youd usd in a light? also i know with kingsnakes you feed outside their enclosers, can you feed the ball python in their encloser or is it better to take them out as well?(i am useing aspen as substrate).
any help will be much appreicated.

Hey,
I think that if you are going to use bulbs to heat your tank I would suggest using the commercial bulbs made for reptiles instead of regular light bulbs because I believe they would give off more heat. Me personally I prefer a heating pad with a thermostat so that your snake can have "belly heat". I would also suggest that you should feed any snake in a separate enclosure to ensure that they don't ingest any subtrate. Hope this helps any...........and good luck!

Why anyone would use a light bulb for heat for nocturnal species is beyond me, because it induces stress. Undertank heat is best for the majority of snake species. None of my snakes have ever had lights for heat. Aspen is fine, and yes balls can be fed in a seperate enclosure, but again the light should be low or off to mimic the snakes prevalence to feed nocturnally.

thanks for the quick reply. i know that ball pythons like the temp warmer then that of a king. my kings have there temps at around 80-84, and balls like 90. i always use an UTH but was woundering if i needed alittle more temp in there. the reptile bulbs where i live are expensive and very few. thats why i was asking about a regular light bulb. trying to get some opinions thats all..

I am sure that the UTH would do just fine as long as you have a thermostat. If you still wanted to use bulbs to heat the tank during the day hours you can try this place for bulbs they are some what cheaper than most pet shops...... http://www.thatpetplace.com

Why would you want to feed outside the cage?

I have done it both ways over the years, but now I feed in the cage and have not had any trouble at all. When you feed out side the cage you have to move the snake back into the cage, sometimes this can stress out a snake. I've seen it cause a healthy snake to regurgitate, I've also seen what happens if you don't wait long enough to move them back, he had waited two hrs, yet the snake was still in feed mode.

With so many balls being so hard to get feeding, I would think you would want to put as little stress on them as you can. To move them to feed them would just add stress.

I feed outside the cage every time. I would rather my snakes not associate things coming into their cage as food. Its all personal preference, but i do feel it is good to feed them outside so that they dont ingest their bedding. Especially if it is just a pet then it isnt such a hassle to simply put the snake in a tub and take the opportunity of the snake out of the cage to do your cleaning. just my opinion

" I would rather my snakes not associate things coming into their cage as food."

In my years of keeping snakes I've never had this happen, but I have heard of it. Most my snakes are bigger, and for the last few years I have used hooks to let them know it's me and not food. Not that I have ever had a snake try to bite me, but why risk it.

You are right, it is up to each owner to do what works for them. For me it's feeding in the cages.

A lady at the pet store where I bought my ball python suggested feeding the snake outside the cage. As an alternative, she also suggested taking the snake out of the cage, handling it for a few minutes, putting the food in the cage, and then putting the snake in the cage. That way, the snake doesn't associate something coming into the cage with food. Because my ball python is still a baby, she suggested putting the snake into the paper bag that the rat pinkie is in when I bring it home from the pet store.

The first time that I tried her method, I ran into the problem that people are describing here. To put the snake back into the cage, I would have to handle her to get her out of the bag. I finally decided against handling her and just put the bag on its side in the cage. She eventually crawled out on her own.

I now take the snake out of the cage and hold her for a few minutes first. I put the bag containing the pinkie inside the cage, and then put the snake in the cage in front of the bag. With this technique, my snake won't associate something descending into the cage as food. Her food will be served inside a paper bag, so there won't be a danger of bedding being caught in her mouth. She'll also be eating inside an enclosed area, and some people have told me that pythons prefer an enclosed area for eating.

I don't have enough experience to say whether this technique is any good. It's what I've come up with after listening to the advice of people with orders of magnitude more experience than I have.

Bill

With this technique, my snake won't associate something descending into the cage as food.

hi Bill,i'm not so sure it is entirely possible to "train" a bp not to do that....I mean,this is what they do(,and have done.For how many years?).Hide under something for a week(or 3 months)and ambush their prey when it comes along.Unless the ambush site sucks...then they just go looking for a better one(Maybe one that has smells and chemical traces of potential prey?).

...although, there are varied degrees of success and failure with anything...maybe you have a really smart one(or dumb one,whichever is needed for said training).

Good luck with him.
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Charles Glaspie

Tanstaafl:
"There ain't no such thing as a free lunch".
An acronym created by my favorite author Robert A. Heinlein.

I'm not experienced enough to know whether any of these ideas work. What you say makes sense. We can't change years of instinct, but some animals are more aaptable than others. Has anyone ever heard to what extent bp's learn stimulus and response? (Typing with s bp climbing on my hand is difficult.) Either way, I appreciate the input.

Bill

Re: snakes associating things entering the cage as food...

I always feed inside the bin...Well I found that did cause my snakes to associate things entering the bin as food. My roommate got a cute baby rat as a pet (I think it's called a dumbo rat or something). Well, I put Jake, the new pet, in with one of my snakes so they could play, and the snake thought he was food and ate Jake! If only I'd fed her outside the cage, then she wouldn't have thought Jake was food!
Jeremy
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Isn't it cooler that serpent's don't walk anymore?
(Genesis 3:14)

WHAAAT!!?

...yah mean he didn't play fair with the "safe zone"?

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Charles Glaspie

Tanstaafl:
"There ain't no such thing as a free lunch".
An acronym created by my favorite author Robert A. Heinlein.

np
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Isn't it cooler that serpent's don't walk anymore?
(Genesis 3:14)

ROTFLMAO!! I'm afraid a rat is food no matter where the snake might meet it.

Quig

I've heard of this happening before. Some keepers even had their snake promise them that they would play nice, only to be let down by the "new friend" having seemingly "went home" while the snake's keeper looked away for a momment. It is best to keep their friends at a distance much as if they had a contagious disease (lets say something like... hunger) or something. LOL

I have never had trouble feeding ours in the cage but there is also nothing in there that they could possibly injest accidently (we use newpaper or reptile carpet). We also try to reach in to pet him a couple times a day to both to get him used to touch and to space out the objects in the cage from becoming associated with hand in cage always means food. Think about it, one time a week food, many times a week pet, pickup/interaction, new water, cage clean... which is more likely to be associated?
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Bryan, Atlanta GA

1-0-0 Rescued Ball Python - Apep
0-1-0 Rescued Mountain Horned Dragon - Ki
0-0-1 Rescued Aggressive Bearded Dragon - Zeus
0-0-1 Rescued Non-Alpha Green Iguana - Bud
1-1-0 Rescued Rats... no wait... ROTTEN Little Cats - Ra, Bastet
0-0-1 Rescued Dieting Panda Hamster - Mr. Fluffy
0-1-0 Rescued Little Angelic Kitten - Isis
1-0-0 Horse... whoops... BIG Golden Retriever - Jake
0-1-0 Wife
2-0-0 Kids