Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I've had them mate before, but I've never maintained proper
humidity levels. That's taken care of via a misting system, so I'm
hopeful this time.

They're such nice animals, I hope I can get some babies. Nobody
wants to breed them because they're not profitable TO breed.
Part of that is because they don't always lay eggs every year,
another is that they take 2-3 years to mature, and another is that
WC animals just do so darned well. With cheap, healthy WC
animals, there's less demand for the few CB produced.

Certainly a weird, unreliable species, but overall very hardy and
impressive. The largest 3 horns, they have a dorsal crest similar to
melleri, are more heat tolerant than other montane species, and not
as vitamin sensative as other montanes either. So what if they'll
suddenly decide to stop eating for a month at a time for no
apparant reason with no ill effects....

Congrats!!! There’s nothing cuter than a baby derm!
-----
~Jamie

Pic's! pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/herphappy/my_photos

Plus, you get to look forward to tiny electric blue babies! I have always liked deremensis too. I know we keep saying that each species is different from the rest, but these guys are. I love their incredibly light sensitive skin. Once you get their setup stabilized they are almost boring...silent, still, more secretive than most, but stable even though they can drive you crazy with fasting. But I always felt mine were calculating the next way to worry me, sizing me up and making me look foolish at the most public moments. That little brain may seem slow, but I suspect they are just very methodical and meticulous. My male would act docile when picked up, but as soon as I thought he was settled on a hand or shoulder he would decide to bite me or throw himself off my hand and hit the floor. Always on a hard floor, never the carpet to make sure I would suffer the most guilt.

I'm not getting my hopes up - not again. I've never been able to
get these things to reproduce. I'll brag when I've got babies. I
hope to have them, as they are unique.

You got it right, that they're weird. They just don't move. They're
practically plants. They don't fuss when you pick them up (well,
mine didn't), and they sit perfectly still... until you get to a hard
floor, then they jump, rotate in mid air (so their horns point
downward, maximizing breakage potential), and go straight to the
floor. For such short legged, fat, slow chameleons, the suckers
could jump. You almost hear a "boing" sound when they do it,
too. First time my CB male did it was scary. I took him to the
kitchen to show my mother how his horns were coming in. The
entire tripw as over carpet, but he waits until I get ot the kitchen,
witha vinyl floor, before springing forward like a fat frog. I caught
him in mid air. Never let him do it again.

I do believe they have the longest tongues for their body length.
My old female was only 13-14" long, but her tongue was at least
18" long. It was freaky. She only shot it the full length when I
bowl fed her, and she was in a tree. Hand feeding, she'd come to
me.

I've always had a problem getting deremensis to eat form a bowl.
My CB male never woudl use them. Fresh imports dont' mind,
but after several months, they'll die sooner than eat from a bowl. I
don't get it. Only if I throw in insects in the cage or hand feed.

Their ability to frustrate is unparalleled. I breed three species of
roaches, mealworms, superworms... I order silkworms...
Nothing. They don't want any of them. I get in my routine order
of crickets, and they go NUTS. It's like the crickets were
something they've never seen before. silkworms, exotic roaches,
superworms, nahhhh... we want crickets!

You described them perfectly! My beautiful male did the horns-down dive at the vet's office. My vet at the time was Kevin Fitzgerald of Alameda East. We both yelled, grabbed, missed, and watched in horror as he splatted on the linoleum. Even Kevin could not come up with a joke! Thankful the Emergency Vets camera crew was not around that day.

This guy would calmly climb up my arm, sit on my shoulder, and after some time peacefully perching there would rock, hiss, and grab my earlobe as if he had just noticed it.

He would seem to eat nothing for weeks and I would nervously shower, adjust humidity, temp, lighting, and the cage, weigh him over and over, devise elaborate ways to hide in the room to watch for feeding, try all sorts of insects in bins, cups, free range, different times, isolate them on sticks, and drive my self nuts. Then he would suddenly eat everything in sight looking at me as if to say "Just what IS your problem?"

I found an annual emergence of small green inchworms on some ornamental trees at the bus depot was a hit. I combed the trees every day on my way home for every one I could find much to the amusement of the other bus passengers. Then the city sprayed the trees of course :[

Yeah, they are unique all right.

dirty little suckers waited until I came in the room - again - before
they started. I didn't notice until after I had thrownin some
crickets.

One of the funniest moments in chameleon keeping - wish I had a
video camera handy.

The female started moving, with the little male on her back
(mounted her, but not copulated yet), and she moved over a foot,
and shot a cricket she wanted. All this with him holding on - like
one of those little plastic frogs-in-amplexus toys.

The female he's been mating with has not shown any signs of
increased weigh yet - no surprise. However, the othe rfemale -
who's hated him from the start - is getting fat. I wonder if she's
gravid from stored sperm. She came in in April, so it's not
impossible. That would be awesome.

with the outcome of this scene, hehehehe They are beautiful chameleons, and it will be exciting to some some youngins from them real soon .

I know you will keep us informed of whats going on, and we will sure know when the kids arrive, by a sure sign.......

"ONE ECSTATIC ERIC"
-----
PHEve / Eve

Contact PHEve

You said..."they have a dorsal crest similar to
melleri"....some of them do and some of them don't. Some of them have a "smooth" dorsal crest. I don't know what the reason is for it...maybe they come from different areas or maybe its just like people having curly hair or straight....but there are two different shapes to the dorsal crests.

You also said..."So what if they'll
suddenly decide to stop eating for a month at a time for no
apparant reason with no ill effects"...is ther any specific time of year that you notice that they stop eating? Any reptiles that I know of that live through climate changes in their natural habitat will slow down or even stop eating during cooler/cold times. Digestion is difficult for reptiles in times of decreased temperature since they rely on external heat sources to warm their bodies. (Even if you are providing warm/hot temperatures for them all the time if they are WC, IMHO, they might be trying to follow the climate pattern for where they come from.) Also, insect availability in the wild would vary with the seasons...so less food would be available at times. Just food for thought.

Hope you have good luck with the breeding! Those "blue" babies are awesome!

Well, it's similar to melleri even when it's smooth - as in it's not a
sail, like quads, cristatus or montium, but more of a high back. I
haven't seen one with a fully scalloped dorsal crest. The
crenulations in melleri crests are the full length o fthe back.
Deremensis usually have th ecrenulations only in the rear portion,
just above the rear legs, to the base of the tail.

I do not know how much is due to environmental conditions,
regional populations, or what, but they vary quite a bit.

Many come in with gnarled horns. Some are spiraled. MY CB
male had nicely curled, rough horns. My LTC male has similar
ones - I go thim when he just had buds. However, the adult male
WC's I had all had perfectly straight, smooth, SHARP horns.
Weird.

the dorsal crests vary quite a bit as well. All my males had
moderate ones, noticable, but not extreme. When I bought my
first female, she was in a cage with a smaller male. My CB male
was 15" long, this one wa sonly 12". But his dorsal crest was
twice the height of my male's. It was as tall as that of a cristatus.
Very weird.

The hunger strikes are weird. I had it with my CB male and my
last wc male. The CB male was the worst for worrying me. He
went two months eating only 2-3 insects the whole time. My little
WC male never did that, and I've not had a female do the same.

Other people reported the same thing.

My CB male did seem to do it prior to mating season, alternating
between gorging and being a lazy slob,and then being very
active and not eating.

I wonder if it had to do with looking for a mate. After I stuck my
WC male in with the females, he stopped doing it. My little male
never did, but he's been in visual contact with females from the
start. I dont' know.

The dorsal crests I was talking about were fully scalloped dorsal crests running from the neck down to the base of the tail...not just near the base of the tail....and you are right that its not a sail like quads or montiums have. I'm not the only one who has commented on this difference in crests either.

I can't say that any of my deremensis have ever had a hunger strike. They do slow down on the amount that they eat when the temperatures are cooler though.

Not eating near mating season I think is different from any other hunger strikes....the reason being obvious. As for your little male, perhaps he's not interested in mating yet?

There;s still a lot to learn about chameleons at any rate.

On them this time Eric. Keep me posted on how they do and whether you get eggs from them.
-----
Rob Trenor
RK Reptiles
www.rkreptiles.com
www.rkreptiles.net
www.oldworldchameleons.com
www.ballpythonmorphs.net
www.beardedragons.com

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