Reptile & Amphibian Forums

this is(was) a healthy 4 year old 1900gram female.
she was bred last year, but it didn't take.

I have witnesed 3 copulations this season so far.

This morning when I went to check on them there was blood and a fair amount of it.

The ring is from were the water bowl was.

There is some sort of blood sac.
here is a close up sorry about the bad photo, low light.

also she just shed, before the reintroduction, there does seem to be some skin on the sac.

any insight would be appreciated.

TomChambers

never seen or heard about that, but my first guess would be a a hemipene got ripped off perhaps??

Hope all will have full recovery... Please keep us posted!

Bristen.

thanks Bristen,

The blood and "sac" came from the female.
I'm still waiting for a call back from my vet, I hope he can identify this, and maybe have some ideas as to what happened.

TomChambers

Looks like a blood clot to me. What caused it is anybodies guess. What about the exterior of the snake? Any obvious wounds or blood around the cloaca? In otherwords, did the blood come from an internal injury?

No there was no sign of external injury, there were small fragments of urates in the blood, and liquid urine as well.

I checked both of their cloaca's and everything looks normal.

They are both acting normal.

My vet didn't get the sample today, he just called and said he would look at first thing thurs since he doesn't work tomorrow.

Maybe he can get some ideas from inspecting the thing.

TomChambers

I'm sorry but that thing is just discusting... You did kind of warn people though but jeez my cheeseburger was barfed up! Anyway I don't know maybe some sort of internal parasite? That would drop a blood sack or 2 out. I've never ever seen that before and if it ever happens to me I wanna know what it is so please keep us updated!

yes.........I had some of those.....from cornsnakes............so if a corn can lose that amount of blood a ball should be fine........I don't know exactly what happens...I assume it is from female.........maybe they get a cut in the vent from rough handling during copulation......maybe she or the male got turned around too much? maybe something rubbed or popped out in a not so nice fasion?........DO Male balls penes have hooks or spikey looking apendages like some snakes do?........

.......my corns showed NO signs of anything being wrong ever and were fine and laid fine.......

good luck.......

look at her vent and all should be ok?...if not.....let us know.....

JY
-----
.............
..............
................
..................

Ok, I have seen something like this before.

The male hemipene has spines on it...these spines can tear or perforate the cloaca, in some instances perforate the bowels of the snake and cause a massive infection in the body cavity.

So what should you do?

I suggest putting it on Baytril for 14 days if you are worried. I had the same thing happen to me many years ago with an albino male and a het albino female. One day I noticed some blood in the cage and the snakes appeared fine so I did not worry. Several days later I was shocked to find the Hetero female dead. I did a basic necropsy on her and when I got to the lower third of her body there was a distinct stench from the massive infection that had occured. Her bowel was perforated from the injury encountered during breeding and she succumbed to the injury.

Or it could be NOTHING!!

Kev @ NERD

Good LUCK!!
-----
www.newenglandreptile.com

"Or it could be NOTHING!"

LOL Are you always this spunky Kev?

Quig

These are the het caramels I got from you a few years back, so yeah I was freaked out.

I don't know if you got my call, but I appreciate your response.

I hope you catch that scumbag that stole the snakes.

I will let you know how it turns out after I meet with my vet thursday.

Thanks again
TomChambers

Tom,

The exact same thing happened to my female snake about 3 weeks ago. I posted here, something about "Help! my snake is passing blood". Anyways, my vet could never figure out what it was and she is doing fine with no signs of any problems now. I soaked her in warm (not hot) water right after I found her with all that blood around her. She passed a bloody "sac" after soaking for a few minutes. It was pretty gruesome.

I'm very interested to hear what your vet has to say. I'm not happy to see it happening to someone else's snake, but I am glad to see it wasn't as much of a freak thing as I thought it was!
-----
-----
Amber

Balls:
1.29.0 Normal
1.1.0 Pastel
1.2.0 100% Het Pied
1.0.0 100% Het Albino
0.1.0 66% Poss. Het Albino
Corns:
1.1.0 Amber Corns
0.0.1 Amel Corns
1.1.0 Butter Motley Corns
1.1.0 Crimson Corns
1.1.0 Ghost Corns
1.1.0 Hypo Corns
0.0.2 Normal Corns
1.1.0 Okeetee Corns
1.0.2 Snow Corns - Aiden & Kids
1.1.0 Sunglow Motley Corns
Milks:
1.1.0 Hypo Honduran Milk Snakes
0.1.0 Pueblan Milk Snake - Marishka
1.1.0 Sinaloan Milk Snakes
Other:
2.1.0 Dachshunds - Dakota, Montana, & Cheyenne
5.0.0 Ferrets - Tigger, Bailey, Cody, Keyta, & Bandit

Liann,

I knew I saw this somewhere, but I bought a new house this past summer (fixer upper), and my mind is always there. I’ll have to look for that post.

My vet said he agreed with Jeff and Kevin, that it was reproductive trauma from the male hemipene.

I witnessed copulation a few days earlier, so it makes sense to me.

He said the “sac” was a big blood clot, I didn't get to talk him today, but he did leave me some Baytril as suggested just to cover all bases.

I do think this is uncommon, as displayed by the lack of posts of those who have encountered this.

I’m glad your girl is doing well.

I’ll let you know if he tells me anything more. He’s hard to get a hold of because he’s the best vet in my area. He usually calls me after he is done working and we B/S later in the evening.

TomChambers