Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I used to be in the freshwater aquarium hobby and a "true" cichlid (colorful african and southamerican fish) owner wanted his fish as close to wild and natural perfection as possible - this seems to contrast with everything I've been seeing lately. The extreme breeding and inbreeding of ball pythons/ etc. to get new and trendy colors and the crossing of different species to make a high dollar.

These animals will one day be near extinction in the wild - and what are we doing to preserves the quality of each species? Or are they just simply more for aethestic purposes, than conservation and enrichment of others? The way I look at is: not too many people out of the whole worldy population care about this or that in regards to snakes, especially large constrictors - so the future of these snakes lies in the hands of hobbyist. It seems that the hobby has fallen large todays king - the dollar.

Not trying to start an argument - just want to hear opinions of other snake owners on the matter.

I have been breeding many kinds of pure breed reptiles over the past 20 years. and now I plan to cross breed a few snakes with on plans that they will be worth any money to other people, only for me to see if they can be crossed and to see just what kinds of cool looking snakes can be man made. I have never noted any of the people breeding snakes for the purpose of making money from them or for there own enjoyment ever releasing there snakes into the wild were they can mix with the wild population. so I don't see were there is a problem! I like to compare hybrid snake to a old car... some people keep the car as pure and close to its original look as possible.. and other people turn it into a totally cool HOT ROD !! so what kind of person are you? would you rather make a pure breed? or a HOT ROD?

Im ready to make some HOT RODS !!

and you?

thanks.

JIM

HOTROD all the way

np
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jake

my addiction:
2 normal ball pythons (lazlo and izzy)
1 amelenistic corn snake (mazy)
0.1 blizzard corn (blizz)

You have the same thing with cichlids lots color morphs in Oscars and convicts infact even long finned oscars -you have blue jack dempseys-popular and EXPENSIVE flower horns-red Parrot cichlids which are very popular in chain type pet stores.
The African cichlids are pure as of now but the South American and Central American have hybrids. In Asia Flower horns go for hundreds much more than any pure cichlid .
it is interesting that African cichlid keepers demand pure but the other cichlid keepers arent purists like African keepers.

when i was in the fish hobby, and specifically at shows - a lot of people disliked hybrids (not true for everyone of course) , and i was just wondering how they are generally viewed in the reptile community

They are disliked also same as fish hobby. In last few years purists have realized they are here to stay and nothing they can do about it but still disliked .

im a cichlid farmer by trade in Miami Fl. and maintain pure stocks of fish but i did a Victorian Hybrid? Hap X Hap)a albino half crimson x an All Red haplochromis f 2 s have coined the name albino candy haps.Remember im a purist when it comes to my wild stock and maintain purity in such fish as peacocks and all other fish . but i broke the rule w/ the Victorian OH NO!!. and i currently own some hybrid Colubrids. ifind it interesting to see hybrid hatchling never before seen !!!Chris

I have seen julie hybrids which werent as pretty as the pures but have also seen Malawi hybrids which I found incredible looking.
I saw electric blue Ali with think zebra hybrid and found them spectacular . I keep Blue dempseys but love the africans to. Might soon set up a large tank with the colorful and fairly easy going yellow "labs". I love the demasoni to but they are fierce.

cichlids rule! demasoni are very prolific so breeding casulties due to pecking order are a problem but in numbers the hirearce is deminished(spell?)btw those hybrids you spoke i dont approve not to be a hypocrite but they degenerate instead of appreciate color and they are still just common pseudos which dont bring a price so they CAN only pollute the industry.african cichlids are from the great rift lakes of africa EXTREMLY DEEP and may be land locked ocean animals from LOOONNNGGG ago.C btw try to keep em PURE.C

np
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jake

my addiction:
2 normal ball pythons (lazlo and izzy)
1 amelenistic corn snake (mazy)
0.1 blizzard corn (blizz)

thats part of the fish farm used to be! thanx to Katrina,Wilma and now T.S. Gamma soon come.[Arms and hands flailings in the air] when is this season over dammit.btw they tell me in 10 days hurricane season will be over .BUT now the biggest obsticle in tropical animal buis is TEMP> soon come COLD fronts, fish and critters are succeptible to these extremes .
if id only chose to raise flying fish id a been done after the first storm.LOL .....Go Tony Stewart,git r done(home depot car 20) here in s. fl.for da RACE.Chris..............

I imagine it must be a nightmare having a fish farm (I guess better than a bird avairy tho lol) ESP this year. I would think further inland Florida would be safer than Miami due to storms?
What do you do about cold fronts though they are short ? Dont you have problems with fish parasites since they are raised outside?
Thanks

i had a tank of yellow labs and demasoni a few years back. great contrast with the yellows and blue/blacks. man those demasoni glowed, i don't think i've seen a prettier fish.

i didn't have any problems with the demasoni. aggressive yes, but i had nice limestone furniture with plenty of hiding spots -and an uncrowded tank.

I agree I love those demasoni. I thought their blue colors and the yellow labs would be a great contrast.
I was under the impression that the demasonis were to aggressive for the labs but think going to do it now. I intend to use lots Texas holy rock.
Thanks

not everyone is in it for the money, and i think the same way about preserving the species but why not have fun and make something cool in the process? you can always breed back to normal coloration
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jake

my addiction:
2 normal ball pythons (lazlo and izzy)
1 amelenistic corn snake (mazy)
0.1 blizzard corn (blizz)

I'm on the fence about the whole cross breeding thing. I wont do it but if somone else wants to i dont really care that much. I do think its pretty stupid to charge extremely high prices for a snake that is a cross..a certain 100k snake comes to mind. I would pay more money for a pure snake that a cross.