Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Are Mojaves the least expensive way to make a Leucistic Ball? I think they are the least expensive way I have seen, plus you get the great Mojave look to boot. Hypo Mojaves? Have you seen them? I saw them in person at Dan and Colette's table at Anaheim, and they were stunning! The Pastel Mojave is not my favorite, have not seen one that blows me away, but if you get one, imagine having the Pastel and Mojave genes in one snake.! Tom,s Crystal Ball was produced from a Mojave, and so was the Super Hypo Mojave Paradox, also produced by the SK's, and seen in person at Anaheim. I think there is way more to do with the Mojave, so please do not breed your male mojave to 75 normal females producing 300 Mojaves, let make some Mojave crosses, are you with me?????

Sounds vaguely like the lets not breed pastel posts of a couple of weeks ago.
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Tosha

"Nihil facimus sed id bene facimus"

7.33.0 Ball Python (Harry and Fluffy and gang)
1.0.0 Angolan Python (Anakin Skywalker)
0.0.1 Green Tree Python (Verdi - yeah I know but my kids love the book)
0.2.0 Feline (Pippen and Pandora)
0.0.1 Desert Tortoise (Pope John Paul aka JP )
2.2.1 Fish (1,2,3,4)
0.0.2 frogs rescued from pool skimmer

No, definately not a let's not breed.......rant. I just think that there were no Mojaves, and then there were tons of Mojaves. I think people think that if they breed a Mojave male to as many normal females as they possibly can, they will make millions. I would like to see more Mojave crosses, not just tons of normal Mojaves produced. I have a great job, make good money, and do not breed Balls to make anything other than vacation money. If the Mojave price falls to $50 each tomorrow, it will not affect me at all. Those with Mojaves, let's make some cool crosses, and not just tons of Mojaves.

Dave

I would rather have more mojaves, cheaper and cheaper rather than super radiculous expi alidosous metticulous mojave.

I understand, some people wait until the Morph they like is $100, and then buy it. There is nothing wrong with that, I guess.

Personally I just feel that while mojave X normal pairings are good and should be happening, the crosses are where it is at. If I personally were breeding I'd be trying new crosses and ones that I like, just to put myself on the map and have some fun while doing it!

I agree with the starter of the post, it is amazing to produce designer balls (more than one color/pattern morph) and in my opinion would be a helluva lot more "fun" to see what pops out of those eggs, maybe something unique, vs. just another mojave(not to take anything away from mojaves, they are visually stunning in their own right no doubt).

Also "normal" mojaves will still be produced as a byproduct of these designer pairings keeping a supply of animals for the new person looking to start their own collection.

Another thing is that when people start seeing the designers involving the mojave mutation, the demand and price will remain high due to demand in producing these snakes.

Dan

Don't worry you wont EVER see be breeding any kind of Mojave. I dont like them or the white snakes they produce. Two of my least fave morphs, only the pinstripe and cinny pastels are worse.

So you like Belgian Beer, and I prefer Pyramid Apricot Ale, not a big deal. If we all liked the same thing, live would be boring. I actually REALLY like Pinstripes, but have to agree that Cinns are not the most eye catching Morph, but have great cross potential too, like the Mojaves. So what Morphs do you have and do you like?

The pin is one of my favorite morphs ever! I think they are just bad looking!

the cinny isn't the best looker, but I have to say I'd take a super cinny (just for looks) over many other morphs out there...

Jeremy
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Isn't it cooler that serpent's don't walk anymore?
(Genesis 3:14)

Don't forget the Silver bullet either! ....that one,was one of my top three favorites for this year.

...and what about a caramel super cinny?...or a super cinny pied!(who knows what thats going to do! )
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Charles Glaspie

Tanstaafl:
"There ain't no such thing as a free lunch".
An acronym created by my favorite author Robert A. Heinlein.

And with each new Mojave cross, people can justify raising the Mojave prices, eh?

What a great plan! (sarcasm, sarcasm, sarcasm)
Make more crosses, put a crazy-high pricetag on the crosses, and in turn raise the price on plain ol' Mojaves. And in turn those who are 'killing the mojave market' (not my statement, just what so many have said in the past) by mass producing will produce more Mojaves since the price is higher.

Reminds me of the classic "Which came first, the chicken or the egg?" scenario.

BB
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"Have you hugged your drummer today?" --- Me

I have never said anything about pricing, I am just realistic, and saw the glut of Mojaves on the KS classifieds this year, and am cringing thinking about how many will be produced this year. Again, I do not make my living off of selling Ball Pythons, and if Mojaves go for $2,000 this year, it will not affect me much at all......OK, I will be vacationing in Cabo instead of Tahiti, you got me! I just think all the crosses this year look great, and if you have Mojaves, why not make some crosses instead of mass producing normal Mojaves. I would love to see Mojave Pieds, Mojave Clowns, Mojave Cinns....

Actually the least expensive way to make a Leucistic ball is with the yellowbellys. And before someone jumps all over me and says "Ivories are not lucistic" let me say, yes they are - by most definitions of Leucisism. Leucistic simply means 'white' and nobody can deny that the main ingrediant in an Ivory is the color white..... Also, from what I've seen, Ivories have a tendency to get whiter as they grow older. However, the ONLY thing that yellowbellies are good for is to produce Ivories. I haven't seen any cross yet that is worth a dang, even the yellow belly pastels I find to be rather Ho Hummmmm...

On the other hand, Homozygous Mojaves produce somewhat white snakes it's true. but I beleive that their real strength is in the crosses they can produce. Mojaves by themselves are rather boring I think. However I rather like the pastaves, the spider mojaves are really quite nice and the crystal ball could cause even the most hardened Boa aficionado to have wet dreams... Frankly I think that mojaves are overpriced. They should be thought of more as a visual 'het' then as an actual morph. But they certainly have their place in the overall scheme of designer balls.

Mark

I have to disagree, I would put the Ivory in the Albino catagory before I would call it a Leucistic. Leucistics have dark eyes, blue or black, while Albinos, and the Ivory if I am not mistaken, have clear or red eyes. Also, the Ivory is more yellow in color than white, and have a yellow stripe.

I also disagree about the Yellow Bellies. By themselves, not all that visually stunning, although they vary greatly in appearance, but the Super Stripe YB that Jarod produced is probably in my top 3 favorite Morphs. I also think the YB crossed with Womas, Spiders, Granites, and other morphs, and fringe morphs, will produce some nice animals, and some real oddities. What about a Yb Mojave cross.....

The Ivories do not have red eyes (they may have red pupils, I haven't looked close enough, but then many animals that have reduced color even though they have pigment in the iris, have reddish tinged pupils) The young ones do have a more yellow color but they do apparently turn quite a bit whiter as they age.

Quite a number of years ago, Pete Kahl imported a white snake from Africa. it also had the faint yellow stripe down the back and at that time I believe that Dave Barker termed it a type 2 Leucistic. If I'm not mistaken, that snake was in fact what is now known as Ivory.

You are right about Jareds Superstripe, I had forgotten about that one, that is a nice yellowbelly designer. However I still stick to my original idea that yellowbellies are the cheapest way to produce a white snake. Actually I think that once more people see adult Ivories, the yellow bellies will go back up in price.

Mark

>>I have to disagree, I would put the Ivory in the Albino catagory before I would call it a Leucistic. Leucistics have dark eyes, blue or black, while Albinos, and the Ivory if I am not mistaken, have clear or red eyes. Also, the Ivory is more yellow in color than white, and have a yellow stripe.
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>>I also disagree about the Yellow Bellies. By themselves, not all that visually stunning, although they vary greatly in appearance, but the Super Stripe YB that Jarod produced is probably in my top 3 favorite Morphs. I also think the YB crossed with Womas, Spiders, Granites, and other morphs, and fringe morphs, will produce some nice animals, and some real oddities. What about a Yb Mojave cross.....

I disagree with you on the Pastel Yellowbellies, they are variable and some are insane looking, I picked up one this fall from Douglas Beard that is very cool looking, almost as colorful as a Super Pastel , but has 2 genes working instead of just one! Besides I look at the big picture , the more genes involved the better , this reduces the number of normals you'll produce and gives you a huge advantage in the % game of the resulting offspring making double, triple, and quad morphs a realistic possibility, and that's were this is all heading , if you doubt me then just wait and see! Anthony McCain-McCain's Reptiles...

I haven't seen very many Pastel yellowbellies but the ones I have seen were not any more impressive then a regular pastel. I don't doubt that there are some wild looking yellowbelly pastels out there, but on the other hand there are some pretty wild normals out there too. It's one of the advantages of a species with such a wide range of variability. I agree that Jareds super stripe yellowbelly is a pretty amazing animal and I do like the ivories fine by themselves. But other then that, I just don't see the yellowbelly as being a major player in the designer crosses. I'd LOVE to be proven wrong, but I'll only believe it when I see it.

Mark

>>I disagree with you on the Pastel Yellowbellies, they are variable and some are insane looking, I picked up one this fall from Douglas Beard that is very cool looking, almost as colorful as a Super Pastel , but has 2 genes working instead of just one! Besides I look at the big picture , the more genes involved the better , this reduces the number of normals you'll produce and gives you a huge advantage in the % game of the resulting offspring making double, triple, and quad morphs a realistic possibility, and that's were this is all heading , if you doubt me then just wait and see! Anthony McCain-McCain's Reptiles...
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