Reptile & Amphibian Forums

We haven't chosen a snake yet, but I'm leaning more and more toward a Sonoran Gopher. I'm checking into corn snakes more as well.

There's a captive-bred reptile show in Maryland on Aug 9th that I can't wait to go to!

Anyhow...my question is...how many of you prefer pre-killed food for your animals? If a snake has been fed live food before, can it switch over to pre-killed? It certainly seems like it would be safer for the snake and much more convenient for me. But....where do you keep frozen mice/rats? In the freezer next to your ice cream and corndogs??? *LOL* I'd like to have the convenience and health benefits for the snake...but how to get over dead rodents in the freezer?

Judy

You can find box freezers in lots of department stores(Sears, Home Depot) that are pretty cheap and don't take up too much space. I personally prefer fresh-killed. I just knock the bejeezus out of them and throw them in the cage. You have to be careful though to make sure they're out before you feed them to the snake. Good luck.

I now officially have everything (including adult Leopard Geckos, Fat-tailed Geckos and Blue Tongue Skinks) eating frozen/thawed once again. I still have clutches incubating, and I'm picking up some more adults this weekend, so the fun starts again.....

Anyway, I much prefer frozen/thawed. Fresh killed is a good second, but for me has it's disadvantages. First off, you have to keep live mice around. They stink. They are messy and a pain in the butt to deal with. I suppose if you only have a snake or three it's not too bad, but if you have a bunch of snakes it's real bad. Secondly, they can and do carry parasites that they can and do pass to reptiles. If you have a clean source or if you are breeding them yourself, that's not such a big issue. If you are getting them from someone that maybe doesn't exactly keep them under the best of conditions, you can get some problems.

I like to buy frozen mice and rats in bulk. It's a lot cheaper and more convenient, plus it's safer for the snake. I keep them in the freezer of a refrigerator that I use for medications and food for lizards, so that refrigeratot/freezer is strictly for herp use.

I get my live food from a clean source. I like to be able to see that they are healthy, which is hard to do when they've been frozen. I've bought frozen in the past and thawed them only to be introduced to a stench that was enough to make any animal wanna' puke. That's not to say that frozen is bad. I'm sure there are good dealers for frozen food, but it's more of a hassle in my opinion. Not all frozen foods are safe. It's quicker and easier to knock them out then to thaw them out. Price is not an issue for me. I have over thirty snakes and I've tried frozen thawed and live. I prefer live. That simple.

That is, fresh killed. I don't throw live food in with my snakes.

Yeah, I think that as long as you're not feeding live as a matter of course, then it's a personal preference thing. I have had lots of snakes that would only take live for a while, until you finally get them switched over. During that time, I switch them first to fresh killed and still kicking, then to fresh killed completely dead, then to frozen/thawed. Some people just like to feed live...if that what they want to do, more power I guess. I wouldn't do it, though. I lost a snake once (a Monocellate Cobra)from being bitten in the side of the head by a mouse and infection finally killed it. That was 25 years ago and I haven't fed live since.

I go freeze/thawed myself because I'm a cheapo and there's a reduced parasite risk. If you're worried about getting bad frozen rodents as has happened to people before enquire on the feeder forum for some good rodent suppliers near you.
Switching most pits over isn't too much of a problem since they are rodent gluttons. I have a hypo northern pine snake who started out on live before I bought him. He loved them squirming and moving. All I did was wait until he went into a shed and then made him wait a little longer, till my next feeding day, after his shed was completed before he got food. He was so happy just to see a rodent he didn't care about it moving or not. Ever since he's been on strict p/k or f/t diet.
As for the getting over rodents in a freezer, I just did it and ignored it. I have a shelf or two dedicated to rats, mice, and rabbits. That usually keeps rats away from hotdogs. The only people who have had to adjust have been my poor housemates who had a hard enough time accepting the snakes. Sorry for the long windedness, just wanted to add my two cents.
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"Bones heal, chicks dig scars. Pain is temporary, glory is forever."
-Evil Knevel

I prefer frozen or live or fresh killed. The reason is basically that it is easier for me.

I buy in bulk, which reminds me I will be getting my shipment in Friday. Anyways.......thawing out the mice/rats is no big deal. Just choose a container that you will be thawing out the rodents in. Could be a cooler, which I use, or a plastic container. I usually thaw for 15 to 30 minutes, depending on the size.

I do store all my mice in the freezer next to the Tombstone Pizzas and the WhiteCastles. LOL! They have their separate bag, and I keep all my snakes food in a plastic bucket containing separate individual bags for each of my snakes.

There is nothing unhealthy about that. In fact, my mice/rats come to me vacuum sealed. I then put all the rodents in the prospective bags, and then I vacuum seal the remaining rodents with my Foodsaver Vacuum Sealer device. That thing alone was made for this! LOL!

Because of how easy and convenient frozen rodents are for me, I can thaw and feed my 25 snakes in a matter of 35 minutes total time. That, coinciding with my clean up time, adds up to my one hour a week cleaning and feeding my snakes.

Take care!

Billy
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Genesis 1:1

i'm quoting this from reading it somewhere but it goes like......'if the rats and mice in the freezer bothers you, then we can just call them cows'. that about sums it up huh!........as far as live vs frozen goes, there is no comparison, frozen is WAY better in every respect. and it's not just the tremendous amount of money saved but all the driving and time that you no longer have to do too! just walk into your kitchen, set out frozens, feed an hour later. done. usually, i'll count out and leave out stuff in a bag before i go to bed at night and feed in the morning. couldn't be any simplier........

Well, actually Dan, it could be a little simpler. I'm trying to train my Indigos to get their own food out of the freezer and thaw it themselves....I'll let you know how it goes. They just won't pick up the plastic wrappers the rats were frozen in...leaves a mess in the kitchen and the wife complains.

oh, keeping snake food in the freezer doesn't bother me cause there isn't any people food in there anyway......in the fridge half however, i do keep an assortment of condiments.....in case i ever do buy some real food......;-O

Sonorans are a good choice, so are the San Diegos. Where is the show in Maryland? I live in northern VA. and would love to go, can you give me any info. As far as food goes I breed mice and dwarf hamsters for my snakes, but I also buy frozen. I think breeding my own feeders is better because I know my feeders are superior quality. Although, if you buy from a reputable breeder frozen is good and is safer and more convenient. Keeping mice in the freezer isn't as bad as you think. I myself am very sanitary and take some extra measures. First I have one shelf in the freezer just for the frozen mice so they don't come in contact with the food. Then I tend to buy vacuum packed mice, it seals everything in and keeps the mice fresh much longer. After opening a pack I keep the mice in thick ziplock bags. I also keep all of the mice in rubbermaid containers which provides extra seal and protection. Let me know if I left something out.

Well, after reading all this, I will most likely go with frozen/thawed mice. (and rats eventually, I imagine...*L*) My hubby barely tolerates the one gerbil we have and the idea of a single snake...so breeding our own rodents would be slightly out of the question. (Although he does suggest--tongue in cheek--allowing the gerbil and snake to share a home together!)

Anyhow, I'll look into finding a really small freezer for storing snake food in. In the meantime, I'm sure having a few tiny frozen mice tucked discreetly into the corner of our regular freezer won't hurt anyone's sensibilities.

As for the show in MD that I mentioned...I will give you a link for it, as well as a show in Virginia later in the year. Also...Sue (aka munchkins) left me two more links on a previous thread about two additional shows.

Aug 9th: http://www.pythons.com/mdshow.html

Aug 23rd: http://www.nvre.org/

Sept 13, 14th: http://www.reptileinfo.com/mars.html

Oct 26th: http://www.pythons.com/vashow.html

Would love to see you there. Where abouts in Northern Virginia are you? We're in Springfield and very new to the area. I'm still trying to find any local breeders and herp clubs. Do you know of any?

Judy

Thanks, I will plan to go to the show in Prince William Fairgrounds, it's only 30 minutes from my home near Tysons Corner. I didn't see any familiar Gopher snake breeders in the venders list, but you never know. Have you checked out Envy Reptiles? They have some amazing Gophers and great prices and service. I don't know of many Pit breeders around here, only person I can think of is my old professor at GMU, he had a huge Pit collection. I myself will breed some of my San Diego Gophers next year for the first time. I have a Bechtel Albino, a normal het Snow, two Anerys (Type A) and (Type B), and soon a green spot Snow. Thanks again for the links.

Pits, in my experince, eat anything, living, dead or decayed. So F/T isn't an issue really. I like F/T for convience--you can keep a hundred or so on hand and not deal with trips to the store as much. They're also cheaper by far--I pay maybe 350 dollars for 8 months feed for my snakes (all 15 or so of them). That includes the shipping, and the rats, which most of my snakes are now on.
I used to just keep them in the family deep freezer, but not everyone liked it, so I got a small upright. It's a little 5 cubic foot job, I think, and holds several hundred medium (100 gram) rats, and would hold probably close to a thousand mice (adults range from 25-40 grams).

Paul
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Cornsnakes and kingsnakes and gophers oh my!

I feed all live simply for that reason. I think frozen rodents are disgusting and I hate dealing with them. I love rodents and so don't mind keeping enough breeders around to keep up with my collection.

I' don't know about everyone else but I've never been able to get a pit to take frozen or even fresh killed prey after the have been feeding on live. But then again I can't even get them to eat anything but rats. In fact, the last time I did get one of them to a mouse, she puked it up later that day.

Note: all my pits are southern pines.
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International Snakes Meetup
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HMMMMMMMMMMM.....

I have wondered that. Is it me, or are southern pines more uptight, nervous, and prone to being sensitive about eating than other pits? Reason why I bring it up is that my only southern pine, a snow southern that I purchased in Daytona last year, acted funny about eating when I first got her home.

I put her in a cage that was really big for her, thinking she would love the extra space. Nope. She ate once or twice and then quit eating all together until I put her in a sweaterbox that was smaller. I guess she felt more secure......????

Billy
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Genesis 1:1

From "The Keeper and the Kept"not an exact qoute)

"Southern Pine Snakes are completely unsuited for captivity."

While I don't agree with this it does have a shred of truth to it. My pines are the boss. They would rather die than eat anything besides a live rat. Therefore, I give them live rats and hope to God that they don't lose an eye or get an infected bite. I do regularly try to switch them to fresh killed though. If thy don't eat it, there's always a king around to do the job.
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International Snakes Meetup
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