Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Is this possible, because i was thinking it through, and if pastel is dominant and albino recessive, it wouldnt be possible for a bp to show the albino phenotype and the pastel phenotype at the same time. Is all that correct or am i way off?
Thanks

It would have been produced by breeding a pastel to an albino and making pastel het albinos, then breeding that to another albino. That's how all animals exhibiting both co-dom and recessive traits at the same time are produced. I personally don't think they're all that spectacular by themselves. But they are nicer than the average albino and are kind of like the next step in albino projects.

n/p

I forget who produced it, but I believe it was just last year (2004).

I'm sure someone will remind me who the breeder was.

BB

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"Have you hugged your drummer today?" --- Me

I beleive it was Tom Carlton @ Cypress Creek.
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Tosha

"Nihil facimus sed id bene facimus"

7.33.0 Ball Python (Harry and Fluffy and gang)
1.0.0 Angolan Python (Anakin Skywalker)
0.0.1 Green Tree Python (Verdi - yeah I know but my kids love the book)
0.2.0 Feline (Pippen and Pandora)
0.0.1 Desert Tortoise (Pope John Paul aka JP )
2.2.1 Fish (1,2,3,4)
0.0.2 frogs rescued from pool skimmer

Yeah, I had guessed Tom Carlton in my original post, but it was deleted for some reason. I re-posted and was re-deleted and eventually got lazy/fed-up and typed the bare minimum required of my post. LOL

BB
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"Have you hugged your drummer today?" --- Me

Im still not really convinced, I dont see a real difference in the "pastel albino". If you do a punnet the dom. does not carry over to the homozygous recessive (albino). I brought all of this up because there is a $20k price difference between the two. Has anyone here ever proved it out. The only way to find out would be to breed a normal to a "pastel albino", there would either be all normals ( het. albinos) or at least one pastel.

I'm still not really convinced,

Why are you so against the idea of a double mutation? We got to see tons of them this year, most all made with pastels and a recessive trait.

Pastel clowns stood the biz on it ear.

Pastel pieds are way cool.

If these can be made, and be obvious, there is no reason albino pastels can be made.

Personally I do see why the pastel/albino is different. Notice the belly and the "blushing"?

Someone wanna post of pic of the two different pastel clowns produced this season? BHB and Snakekeeper both made them.

Will you believe it when these images are posted?
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AMAZON REPTILE CENTER

NAMED BEST REPTILE STORE IN LOS ANGELES

There are a few dominant x co-dom mixes so it is possible - sorry my genetics isn't far enough along to be able to tell you the precise punnet square theory behind them - it may be another 1/8 shot or a 1/16 shot at getting a dom x co dom mix morph.

Others are pastel clowns, pastel hypos, hypo Spiders, killer bees, hypo Mojave, albino spiders, pastel pied - theres probably more I just cant name them off the bat.
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Tosha

"Nihil facimus sed id bene facimus"

7.33.0 Ball Python (Harry and Fluffy and gang)
1.0.0 Angolan Python (Anakin Skywalker)
0.0.1 Green Tree Python (Verdi - yeah I know but my kids love the book)
0.2.0 Feline (Pippen and Pandora)
0.0.1 Desert Tortoise (Pope John Paul aka JP )
2.2.1 Fish (1,2,3,4)
0.0.2 frogs rescued from pool skimmer

I meant co-dom recessive - fingers typing faster than brain thinking tonight.
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Tosha

"Nihil facimus sed id bene facimus"

7.33.0 Ball Python (Harry and Fluffy and gang)
1.0.0 Angolan Python (Anakin Skywalker)
0.0.1 Green Tree Python (Verdi - yeah I know but my kids love the book)
0.2.0 Feline (Pippen and Pandora)
0.0.1 Desert Tortoise (Pope John Paul aka JP )
2.2.1 Fish (1,2,3,4)
0.0.2 frogs rescued from pool skimmer

lie to everyone that thinks that ball python mutations are genetic. what we really do is take our normal ball python eggs after they have been layed into our labs (we all have them). Then we carefully do a quick resequencing of their genetic codes altering their color's and patterns. while this procedure is quite easy, it is a long process. that is why the large breeders produce more as they have the funds to hire other genetic engineers to help them. I only do this by myself so i can only lie to a few people each year.

NOW DO YOU BELIEVE THAT!!!!!

Josh Hutto.......JKReptiles

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2.3 het pied (RDR, alan bosch x 2, BHB x 2)
1.1 het albino (ben siegel, gulf coast)
1.2 het citrus ghost(gulf coast line)
1.0 citrus ghost (gulf coast line)
0.1 graz pastel female
1.6 05 normal bp's
0.6 04 normal bp's
2.5 adult normal bp's (some need breeding to see if norm)
4 various corns
0.1 brazilian rainbow boa (alan bosch)
1.0 american pit bull terrior
1.1 taco dogs (ankle biters)
1.0 grey cat
1.1 bearded dragons

a BAD dog is MADE not bred, support the American Pit Bull Terrior as the greatest breed of dogs on Earth!!!!!

n/p
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Under a dead ohio sky,
Eleven has been and will be waiting,
Defending his light,
And wondering...
Where the hell have I been?
Sleeping, lost, and numb.
So glad that I have found you.
I am wide awake and heading home.
TOOL

of course normal x pastel albino offspring wouldn't show the albino traits. only the pastel traits. however, if 1/2 of the pair is het albino and crossed with a pastel het albino (double het) you have a 1 in 8 chance per egg that you'll get a pastel albino. cross an albino with a pastel het for albino and you've got a 1 in 4 chance per egg that it's going to show both traits. wether you're convinced or not, that's the science of it.

later

I'm working with a few male pastel het albinos that I hatched out last year whom will be bred to one of my albino ladies this year. I've got a 1/4 odds of producing an Albino Pastel. Any questions, feel free to e-mail me.
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www.strictlyballs.ca

Just to clarify, the pastel mutation is not dominant as you describe it. It is actually 'incomplete' dominant / 'codominant', in that the het form is different to the homo form. Compare this with say the spider mutation.

With regards to crossing this morph with a recessive morph, how do you feel about Sunglow boas (recessive x dominant)?.....or even closer to home, I guess by your calculations, a pastel....mmmmm...clown wouldn't be possible?

I think you need to look at that albino in a few years - it'll be different from your average albino I'm sure. Even if not, it'll be a powerful tool outcrossed to other morphs.

(image from Ebn website)

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Thanks for clearing that up, I didnt realize that pastel was incomplete/co-dominant.
I wasnt trying to upset anyone so theres no reason for anyone to get their panties in a twist.
Sorry for not knowing everything.

Alrighty, let's clear this up once and for all. The only reason there were some slightly snippy comments responding to you is because you made comments not believing people when you asked for advice. We tried to share with you and you did not believe it. So there you go.

Don't get your panties in a bunch either. We are here to help.. It's just if you want to accept it or not.

Have a great night.
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-Ohh, what a Lady-

Balls for Life, Baby!

I really wasnt trying to offend anyone or reject comments.
Im sorry if it was taken that way.
I was just looking for a more thorough explanation. Im really interested in the biology side of all of this that is why i am so interested.
again im sorry for my responses

thank you everybody this string was packed full. i learned a lot.

Here are some links to help you out.

http://www.newenglandreptile.com/care.html

http://joepociaskpythons.tripod.com/start/genetics.htm

http://www.ballpython.ca/genetics.html

http://www.ralphdavisreptiles.com/matrix/squares.asp

...and a few morph lists too.

http://www.ralphdavisreptiles.com/matrix/proven_unproven_traits.asp

http://www.nextworldexotics.com/hg.htm
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Charles Glaspie

Tanstaafl:
"There ain't no such thing as a free lunch".
An acronym created by my favorite author Robert A. Heinlein.

wow that is a lot of info thank you it opened my eyes to the morph game that you guys like to say. thank you