Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hi. I am new here and I have a few questions about dwarf boas ( I am thinking of getting a sonoran desert boa.). What locale boa is
a. Small ( Adult males under 5ft)
b. Easy to tame ( I hear sonoran desert boas arent vary tame)

I would say that almost all dwarf boas tend to have an "attitude", And what I mean by Attitude is they usually hiss very loudly, and very much like to show off how upset they are. Don't get me wrong they can and will strike just like any other Boa, but from my experience Dwarfs, and especially Sonoran Desert Boas like to "Talk" and most of the time mine are all bluff, but they do put on a good show. I wouldn't discredit Dwarfs beacuse of there attitude, I have seen many other locales of boas be the same way. If you looking for a generally smaller boa, and price is an issue...Sonorans are a GREAT choice. Another neat thing about Sonorans is that there is several natural accuring morphs on the market now, Leopard boas, and Hypos both are a natural Color and Pattern morph. I will say that my sonorans do have lots of character, and are very unique. As far as other locales, They tend to be more higher priced, as far as Crawl Cays, and Cay Caulkers, and Corn Islands....Sonorans you can generally find nice ones for under $200 most are $100-$150 range, about the same price as a Hog Island. Good luck on your choice, Hope that wasn't too long a post...Sorry.
David

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"Life is a Safari"

Sonorans are a great choice...if you want a smaller version, look up the Tarahumara Boa, They look simular to a Sonoran but they are smaller. If you go to www.riobravoreptiles.com, They have a whole page on Mexican Boas. Good luck

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"Life is a Safari"

Thanks. Would a 30"X60"X30" be a good size for an adult tarahumara mountain boa, or could I get a smaller one? Do they have the same husbandry requirements as other BCI?

What about hog island boas?

I used to have a nice colony of Hog Islands, but now I am down to just one pair of Hog Islands. They are another good species, almost the opposite of Sonorans in color and pattern, Hog Islands are usually very pale, and very little pattern compaired to Sonorans who are very dark and heavy patterned. I have always been partial to Island boas, Something about being isolated on an island and its a boa...both together make a great combo. If you are wanting to get Hog Islands, I would say take your time and find a good breeder, The Hog Island has now been crossed with the Hypo boa, and there are quite a few mixes around, and it will only get worse from here as more and more people breed to produce something new and different. Don't get me wrong some of the Sunset boas that are produced are beautiful, but I keep Hog Islands cause they are Hog Islands, and like them the way they are. Good luck...and if I where you I would get both eventually...Thats what I did, I couldn't make up my mind which I liked more.

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"Life is a Safari"

Thank you very much for all your help, I appreciate it.

I don't really treat my Sonorans or my Hog Islands any different than any other BCI. It sounds like those dims are big enough, most Sonorans and Hog Islands max out at around 5-6 feet, with some of the Tarahumaras reaching 4-5 feet. Different keepers and breeders have different opinions on how to keep their boas, but for me I don't treat them any different. No special requirements, at least from my experience.
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"Life is a Safari"

Thanks. I think I will probably get a tarahumara mountain boa later this month.

There are only a handful of breeders that work with Tarahumara's, You don't see them very often, But you might check Rio Bravo Reptiles, and Cutting Edge Herps, They are the two I know of off hand. Good Luck, and keep your eyes open there are a few keepers and breeders on here that post every once and a while.
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"Life is a Safari"

Thanks. I am probably going to a reptile show in Pomona on Dec. 17 (In SoCal) and either I will get a hog island boa or I will just pick up some supplies (bedding, branches, water bowl.) and order a tarahumara mountain boa online from one of those breeders.

It has nothing to do with the animal and almost everything to do with how you handle, treat and care for it.

Doesn't matter what snake you get, tame is not a reality. You can have the calmest snake in the world bite when least expecting. On the flip side, all the snakes my friends call devils and can't handle without gloves, I pick up with bare hands and do not get bitten.

This is not an attempt to make me look like some expert snake rangler.

THIS IS an attempt to have you and others understand, this is NOT a dog, and will NOT come tame, or become tame because you handle him a few times.

When new/first time customers are mislead this way, they usually call back after the first time the snake even LOOKS at them the wrong way demanding a refund because he is 'not tame'.

Your first experience with these beautiful creatures can be horrible due to your misguidance.

I suggest you go out and read some books or websites.

At the very least, look back at the other pages in this forum... your question and questions like it are answered several times a day.

Wish you the best...
Take care, Joe

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Thanks and take care - Joe Rollo
'Tis not the stongest of the species that will eventually survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change' Charles Darwin

I understand that. I know that reptiles arent dogs or cats and that they are never realy tame. I didn't realy mean tame, what I meant to say was something more along the lines of "If handled regularly are sonoran desert boas still more prone to bite/have "attitude" than other boas?" Sorry I didn't word my question very well. I am not expecting to get a scaly dog that fetches frisbees for me.

"I suggest you go out and read some books or websites"
I have read websites, that is why I asked "Do they have the same husbandry requirements as other BCI?" not " What are the husbandry requirements of BCI?" which would have made alot more sense to ask if I didn't already know the how to care for it.

Hey pal, do what you like...

I wouldn't think you'd still have these questions/concerns if you read some good sites, but that's cool...

I am trying to get a point across, which seems still not clear to you.

Doesn't matter how long you handle them. You can handle your pet snake for 20 years. You bring me to your house one day to show me your pet, reach to grab him, and he bites you.

The devil snakes my friends can't handle do nothing but strike at them all day and night, even when they are not in the room, the snake strikes at the glass/cage! then I grab it and make it change it's attitude completely.

There is no thought process, there is no loyalty, there is no recognition.

but hey, whatever floats your boat..
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Thanks and take care - Joe Rollo
'Tis not the stongest of the species that will eventually survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change' Charles Darwin

OK, I see your point. The snake is not the issue, the issue is how you treat the snake.

not treat him as in if you treat him nice and praise him often he'll roll over for you to tickle his belly.. lol

one thing is them falling into the habit of being aproached by something (you) that although seems big and scary, is actually harmless

another thing is how some people condition their animals to differentiate between 'I wanna hold you' and 'Time for Dinner!'

I remember an old friend who had a burmese python in a huge cage with a screen cover.. (not the greatest housing, but this was about 15 years ago) He would quitely remove the screen and go in to pet him before picking him up, and when it was feed time, he had a big chain he would pounce and rattle up on top of the screen, causing quite a racket, and the snake would know that's when it is time to eat.. the other times, there is no food coming..

These days, a safe, easy practice is to feed them in seperate containers, not in their cages.

another thing is how you handle the animal.
Usually, very slow, deliberate movements are taken as harmless and seldom noticed. Have him feel comfortable at all times, and their is no reason for him to get agitated, nervous or defensive... three behaviors we simply label as "aggressive".

another thing I tell beginners...
Be his tree, or be his ground..
let me explain..

If you were snatched up from your home and taken to a foreign planet and dumped somewhere new/different, and there were giants all around you that seemed really scary and threatening.. (this is what they more than likely experience.. no?)
You could be scared, angry, defensive, and all three and more.. you will be worried about and defensive against anything that comes near you... anything you see over you, approaching you, etc.. the ONLY thing you are sure of and will not even consider attacking is the ground you are standing on.
Divert the snakes attention and get him on your hand. Make him feel as if that is the ground, or a tree branch.
You can try this and see how if you wave your other hand near him or make like you are going to grab him, he may get defensive against that hand. He may look up at you. He will more than likely not turn around to the hand holding him and try to bite it.

another thing is knowing the snake's limitations.. how far he can strike, to what degree he can turn, how far can he reach AROUND the corner, or AROUND the cage opening... you'd be surprised..
then you can learn how to control his movements by keeping him off balance so he can not act and move the way he would want too.. this drastically limits his ability to try to bite you.. he can not focus on 'attacking', but rather trying to save himself, make sure he keeps balance, etc..

These are some of the little things you pick up and learn while dealing with snakes for so many years.. not necessarily something you need to know now or need to practice everytime you handle a snake, but chances are it will make it much easier..

Try to be more aware of all these little things and more.. you tend to realize so much more about behavior and handling and more..
You realize.. like I can honestly say, the handful of times i've been bitten have totally been my fault..

all that fancy Indian Snake Charming Flute Dance hogwash is nothing more that diverting the snakes attention and/or maintaining the snakes focus.. so easy.. you can do it with a little practice.
(CAUTION: NOT IN ANYWAY A SUGGESTION TO GO OUT AND GET A VENEMOID TO DO THIS WITH!!) lol... gotta throw that in there..

Anyway, understand this, at the end of the day, Central American Boas, ANY subspecies, are not as 'domesticated' as colombian bci are. They have not been bred in captivity for generations and generations like the colombians have.
One must expect them to still haave a much greater deal of natural instinct left in them.
A little more instinctive and reactive. A little more agile and curious.
They are not really used to 'friendly giants'.. lol

You can NOT say that there is a real temperment difference between a certain breed of dog and the other, or a purebreed and a mutt, that is like saying some snakes are more tame than others.
The fact is that some central american boas may act more like a wolf hybrid dog.. these are first or second generation wolf dog crosses and still have a whole lotts WILD in them. They can not be compared to a house dog that you could keep around the family and the kids.

Now I actually have to get some work done here!

Take care, Joe Rollo - Bci Joe
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Thanks and take care - Joe Rollo
'Tis not the stongest of the species that will eventually survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change' Charles Darwin

spilt the beans and wondered why I didn't hear anything back...

later, Joe
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Thanks and take care - Joe Rollo
'Tis not the stongest of the species that will eventually survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change' Charles Darwin

Thanks.

glad I can help
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Thanks and take care - Joe Rollo
'Tis not the stongest of the species that will eventually survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change' Charles Darwin

>>Hi. I am new here and I have a few questions about dwarf boas ( I am thinking of getting a sonoran desert boa.). What locale boa is
>>a. Small ( Adult males under 5ft)
>>b. Easy to tame ( I hear sonoran desert boas arent vary tame)

I've had sonorans for a few years now and have to say-each snake is different. Both of mine were tame until I bred them. Then the male went nuts, but the female is still fairly tame. The babies are almost always hissy, but tend to calm down with regular handling.

My adult male is 5' and my female is a tiny bit over that. They're both 5 years old, maybe 6.

If you want a smaller dwarf boa, try Cay Caulker boas. They're about the same price as Sonorans, have a block-type pattern, and stay small. My adult female is 4' and 3 years old. She hasn't grown any more. Caulkers are nippy as babies, but turn into wonderfully tame adults. Males grow to 3-4' but usually tend to stay under 3'.

-cat
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http://www.lowergroundreptiles.net/