Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I just spoke to the woman who is sort of “spear heading” the effort to fight this proposed bill. She is very sharp. She’s a good person to have on our side, having political experience and many contact in politics. She’s working this aggressively, but is not really a “reptile person”
(she’s into cats)

Anyway, so far I know that someone in a political office in Crawford county got together with a member of the state house of representatives (email me for the name of the person) to try to get an exotic ban in effect.

If you currently owned one of the animals on the list, you could keep…BUT…you’d have to:

-pay $40 per animal
-pit tag and register your animals and address
-be open for 24 hr, no notice inspections (failure to do so would be grounds to issue a search warrant)
-NOT breed or get any more of the animals
-spay / neuter the animals (hmmm….reptiles?)

It gets better. If you have FRIENDS who have unregistered animals, you are OBLIGATED to rat them out, or you’ll never be eligible for any permit, (what kinda commie crap is that?)

There is a list in place of the “exotic animals” that would be effected, but…they are supposedly still adding to it. It’s funny, they do not phrase it “potentially dangerous exotic animals”, just “exotic animals”, but you can tell by the short list that they are trying (poorly, but trying) to create the list of dangerous, not all, exotics.

So far the reptiles specifically mentioned are:

- crocodile monitor
- nile monitor
- all members of elapidae
- members of boidae that reach lengths in excess of 8’
- GREEN IGUANAS
- Rock iguanas

more to come on the list I’m sure….

Another note…supposedly they are trying to “break up” the animal people.
In other words…they may scheme to get something on the books that many people can live with…and then sneakily try to add animals a few at a time to it once it’s on the books to avoid mass numbers of upset people at one time.

More details as I get them….also, if anyone wants to get involved and would like to talk to the lady who set this up…she can give you more details I’m sure. Email me and I will send you her phone #.

email to: herpconservation@hotmail.com

Thanks,
Dean Alessandrini
Greater Cincy Herp Society
www.cincyherps.com

They have niles but not waters or komodos? That's a weird list so far. Sad that they're making a list for public safety that is based on current market trends and not on the actual danger presented by the animals. And boids over 8 foot? Is there any information to help back up using 8 foot as the mark, or is that just some random number that they deemed to be "big"?

And for the green iguanas, I think there should be a state issued IQ test before someone can buy those. If you get over 90, you can buy one. That would take care of most of that problem...

Sometimes I think it is an IQ porblem, but the fact is that the county fair and most of the county fairs in Ohio give iguanas as prizes to children. Now obviously, none of these people getting an iguana for a five year old know what they are getting.

The incidents that I know of with large snakes are with teenagers.

Some animals are not children's pets and the fact they are treated that way is why the problem.

>>-pay $40 per animal

I personally dont see a problem with that cost. I personally see that as rather fair. However, for people who keep a large sum of the banned animals, that might get quite expensive.

>>-pit tag and register your animals and address

I am personally not a fan of the PIT tagging deal, however, if done by a "qualified" vet that has a good track record I might be a bit more open to it.

>>-be open for 24 hr, no notice inspections (failure to do so would be grounds to issue a search warrant)

Well, since I seriously dont see a ODW officer knocking on my door at 2am, I dont have a problem with this. However, if an ODW officer DOES knock on my door at 2am, he might be leaving without a few teeth.

>>-NOT breed or get any more of the animals

Breeding I could "somewhat" deal with, as I personally feel that of the animals that will be banned, there are far too many being bred anywhere which makes it hard to find appopriate homes for them. Not getting anymore, however, is absolutely proposterous!

>>-spay / neuter the animals (hmmm….reptiles?)

Yeah, let's see try that one!

>>It gets better. If you have FRIENDS who have unregistered animals, you are OBLIGATED to rat them out, or you’ll never be eligible for any permit, (what kinda commie crap is that?)

They can personally kiss my @$$ on that account!

>>- crocodile monitor- ridiculous
>>- nile monitor- ridiculous
>>- all members of elapidae- While I am still against it, I can somewhat understand. Antivenin for this species is very hard to get ahold of unless it's from a zoo, therefore you are definitely causing some issues if this animal escapes. If someone can keep their own stock of antivenin and can provide VERY secure caging, I personally dont have a problem with this.
>>- members of boidae that reach lengths in excess of 8’- ridiciculous, although I think the ownership certainly needs to be controlled.
>>- GREEN IGUANAS- I personally dont have any arguments on this one. I support someone who keeps them successfully, but they are a dime a dozen and most people are seriously not prepared. Too many standard pet stores will be selling them as well.
>>- Rock iguanas- Don't have any personal experience with these guys, so I won't comment. However, it "appears" that they might be similar to the ownership of Green Iggy's. Not too sure however.
>>
>>more to come on the list I’m sure….- Of course! They are missing, crocodilians and ALL venomous snakes! That will be sure to be on the list, and I personally plan to raise hell about the crocodilians.
>>
>>Another note…supposedly they are trying to “break up” the animal people.
>>In other words…they may scheme to get something on the books that many people can live with…and then sneakily try to add animals a few at a time to it once it’s on the books to avoid mass numbers of upset people at one time.
>>
Sounds like the bull$hit that they would do. I say we keep on our P's and Q's and then if they try anything that stupid we put their testicles in a vice!

Chris
-----
U.A.P.P.E.A.L.
Uniting A Proactive Primate and Exotic Animal League

Personally, if they can set up a system that opens us to 24hr searches and a permit of $40.00 per animal, I dont see why they cant just set it up as a standard permit system that will allow RESPONSIBLE exotic animal keepers to keep what they have AND obtain more provided that it is registered? I also wouldnt have a problem if a group of "specialists" got together and made a list of recommended or minimum caging requirements for various animals. That might help a little as well.

What do you guys think?

Chris

>>>>-pay $40 per animal
>>
>>I personally dont see a problem with that cost. I personally see that as rather fair. However, for people who keep a large sum of the banned animals, that might get quite expensive.
>>
>>>>-pit tag and register your animals and address
>>
>>I am personally not a fan of the PIT tagging deal, however, if done by a "qualified" vet that has a good track record I might be a bit more open to it.
>>
>>>>-be open for 24 hr, no notice inspections (failure to do so would be grounds to issue a search warrant)
>>
>>Well, since I seriously dont see a ODW officer knocking on my door at 2am, I dont have a problem with this. However, if an ODW officer DOES knock on my door at 2am, he might be leaving without a few teeth.
>>
>>>>-NOT breed or get any more of the animals
>>
>>Breeding I could "somewhat" deal with, as I personally feel that of the animals that will be banned, there are far too many being bred anywhere which makes it hard to find appopriate homes for them. Not getting anymore, however, is absolutely proposterous!
>>
>>>>-spay / neuter the animals (hmmm….reptiles?)
>>
>>Yeah, let's see try that one!
>>
>>>>It gets better. If you have FRIENDS who have unregistered animals, you are OBLIGATED to rat them out, or you’ll never be eligible for any permit, (what kinda commie crap is that?)
>>
>>They can personally kiss my @$$ on that account!
>>
>>>>- crocodile monitor- ridiculous
>>>>- nile monitor- ridiculous
>>>>- all members of elapidae- While I am still against it, I can somewhat understand. Antivenin for this species is very hard to get ahold of unless it's from a zoo, therefore you are definitely causing some issues if this animal escapes. If someone can keep their own stock of antivenin and can provide VERY secure caging, I personally dont have a problem with this.
>>>>- members of boidae that reach lengths in excess of 8’- ridiciculous, although I think the ownership certainly needs to be controlled.
>>>>- GREEN IGUANAS- I personally dont have any arguments on this one. I support someone who keeps them successfully, but they are a dime a dozen and most people are seriously not prepared. Too many standard pet stores will be selling them as well.
>>>>- Rock iguanas- Don't have any personal experience with these guys, so I won't comment. However, it "appears" that they might be similar to the ownership of Green Iggy's. Not too sure however.
>>>>
>>>>more to come on the list I’m sure….- Of course! They are missing, crocodilians and ALL venomous snakes! That will be sure to be on the list, and I personally plan to raise hell about the crocodilians.
>>>>
>>>>Another note…supposedly they are trying to “break up” the animal people.
>>>>In other words…they may scheme to get something on the books that many people can live with…and then sneakily try to add animals a few at a time to it once it’s on the books to avoid mass numbers of upset people at one time.
>>>>
>>Sounds like the bull$hit that they would do. I say we keep on our P's and Q's and then if they try anything that stupid we put their testicles in a vice!
>>
>>Chris
>>-----
>>U.A.P.P.E.A.L.
>>Uniting A Proactive Primate and Exotic Animal League
-----
U.A.P.P.E.A.L.
Uniting A Proactive Primate and Exotic Animal League

If you had kids would you want to live next door to someone with hots?
I think thats great to ban in any state.

Luis

I will agree that I have issues with the current laws in Ohio when it comes to hots, but I don't feel a ban helps anything. Under this new legislation, the same people will have their venomous snakes, and they will still be keeping them in the same condition. In the future, anyone that wants them will simply buy them over state lines. Not even mentioning the ridiculous bans on other groups, the ban on any venomous animals will simply cause an underground ownership that couldn't be tracked in the case of an escapee. Allowing the ownership of venomous animals with certain permits and random searches to ensure that caging is up to a certain minimum, that makes a great deal more sense in my opinion. What does banning help? We've all seen how much illegalizing drugs has helped. Someone's snake gets lose and kills a kid, they're liable for it now. If the animal is banned or simply requires permits, they would still have to be facing the same amount of charges in the situation. I might be completely over looking something, but a total ban seems to only be a good idea if we were living in a world of robots that could only act by the law.

Someone's snake gets lose and kills a kid, they're liable for it now.

Yes they are liable if you know who the snake belongs to . I am not concerned about a persons so called "rights" to own a venemous snake but the rights of neighbors not to worry about an escaped venemous snake.
However you make a good point . I was recently in Miami and talking to a friend of mine that works in law enforcement. He was telling me about some guy that had a few hots in his house in fish tanks with screen lids and weighed down with books and 2 young daughters. I imagine having hots to this guy meant more than the safety of his kids.
The guy was garbage anyway and was arrested for something else.
The snakes were illegal which actually does prove your point perhaps your right .

There are people out there that deserve to enjoy their passion for venomous snakes just the same as someone enjoying keeping their kingsnakes. It's a huge responsibility and requires alot of commitment and caution, however, it can AND HAS been done successfully without any major issues arising. The story that you heard from your friend is very true and that person is a complete moron and very irresponsible. Anyone responsibly keeping venomous snakes will have ESCAPE-PROOF caging, and proper tools for each job. Banning venomous snakes will not help anything...it will only make things worse. People are going to keep Burmese Pythons and Rattlesnakes in cardboard boxes regardless what the law says. If they are keeping them like a moron, they will continue to be a moron. Banning drugs and automatic weapons haven't helped much has it? Ferrets have been banned in California for a good period of time, but just think of the thousands that are in there right at this moment. Granted, ferrets can't kill anyone, but it gives an example.

Banning something isn't the way to resolve a problem. Making a permit system and making things harder to obtain would be more the way to go. With a responsible venomous keeper next door, you are in more of a threat of getting struck by lightening rather than getting bitten by their snakes.

JMO.

Chris

>>Someone's snake gets lose and kills a kid, they're liable for it now.
>>
>>
>> Yes they are liable if you know who the snake belongs to . I am not concerned about a persons so called "rights" to own a venemous snake but the rights of neighbors not to worry about an escaped venemous snake.
>> However you make a good point . I was recently in Miami and talking to a friend of mine that works in law enforcement. He was telling me about some guy that had a few hots in his house in fish tanks with screen lids and weighed down with books and 2 young daughters. I imagine having hots to this guy meant more than the safety of his kids.
>> The guy was garbage anyway and was arrested for something else.
>> The snakes were illegal which actually does prove your point perhaps your right .
-----
U.A.P.P.E.A.L.
Uniting A Proactive Primate and Exotic Animal League