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Chinese eating endangered NY terrapins for medicinal qualities

Brian Macker Jan 04, 2006 01:55 PM

First with the snakeheads and bear livers and now they are eating up endangered terrapins. See the linked article.

If you live in the area and it is convenient please check on these markets and report them if you see any terrapins. If you don't live in the area and there are any Chinese markets near you please monitor them also. Report them to the DEC.

They should screen these bastards for stupid superstitions before they let them in the country. I say that because the Chinese-Americans that I know that are integrated and don't believe this baloney. Perhaps we need some special lesson plans in isolationist china-town school districts too. I don't know I don't leave near one but apparently there is some contengent of chinese who are into mumbo-jumbo in this country.
Chinese illegally eating diamondbacks

Replies (11)

honuman Jan 05, 2006 12:49 PM

I monitor this situation in NYC constantly. There are folks here that are trying to crackdown on it but the problem is that as long as it is legal to sell them in the markets (and it is as long as they follow the guidelines -- WHICH SO Many DON'T) No one seems to enforce it. ALso they sell tons of redbelly turtles and sliders painted turtles, snappers and softshells there too. All kept in hideous conditions. Most (save for the softshells and possibly the sliders) are wild caught (not farm raised)animals.

Also not just the Asian people buy these animals so you shouldn't point fingers only at them. There are restaurants that buy them direct from the (now relocated) Fulton Street fish for use in their restaurants in soup. While the popularity of such a dish has dimished some, it still is eaten by other cultures than the Chinese.

What I wonder is if the people that consume these animals have any idea what kind of diseases and parasites they have? I have rehabbed many of them and I will tell you that after the stress of being in those meat markets has hit them they get some real funky diseases. You wouldn't catch me eating that fungus infested, SCUD and pinworm ridden meat.

As far as the mumbo jumbo stuff goes IMHO that is a matter of personal opinion and better expressed on a forum that discusses that sort of thing.

Steve

erico Jan 06, 2006 02:25 PM

I have been taken to task by Asians for my comments before, but one of the main threats to the survival of many Asian turtle species is Chinese folk medicine, and the belief that certain species will guarantee long life. Even affluent well-educated Asians consume turtle products (including ground plastrons) in a rather unecological assertion of their ethnicity. I would urge Asians in this country, at least, to examine their precepts. Is it a true belief in the life-extending powers of a threatened species - tiger bones and bear gall bladders are also important in folk medicine- or are you merely celebarting your ethnicity at the expense of seriously endangered species?

erico Jan 06, 2006 02:37 PM

I do NOT mean to condemn all Asians by my previous posting, as MANY Asians are among the top people in turtle taxonomy, husbandry and conservation.

honuman Jan 06, 2006 05:20 PM

True enough about the Asian species being eaten into extinction.
That is another BIG problem apart of the consumption of DBTs here in the US.

What frustrates me HERE is that we have laws which strictly govern, how, when, what size and how many dbts can be harvested. I see these restrictions violated on a regular basis and nothing ever seems to get done about it.

There are supposed to be these safeguards in place. I have seen vast numbers of diamond backs way over the legal size (never under) sitting in these markets.

Though eating turtle may be unappealing to most of us (myself included) there are options available to those who insist in this practice.

The Chinese softshells in these markets are all farmed raised and the sliders are as well.

Why destroy wild populations?

So, (at least in the US) I think they need to try and nip this thing in the bud at the harvesting level first and then work on the cultural thing. (and again it does stem further than just Asian people eating consuming the diamondbacks). Ally snappers, Northern Redbellies and many other turtles end up being harvested from the wild and shoved in a stew pot.

One organization I work with even rescued a North American wood turtle from being served up in a stew.

If we figure out a way to curtail the wild harvesting we can at least (like it or not) keep the consumption of turtle for food, medicinals and whatever else restricted to prolific FARM RAISED species (like red eared sliders).
We as turtle lovers may find THAT objectionable as well but would it be any worse than eating a chicken or cow or any other FARM RAISED creature? At least wild populations would not be hurt by this practice.

Katrina Jan 06, 2006 09:46 PM

What you're likely seeing are females harvested legally from Maryland and sold in NY. Maryland does not have a slot size limit, NY does. MD only has a minimum size limit - if it's six inches or larger on the BOTTOM shell, it can be harvested in MD. That means that basically ONLY females will be harvested - not a good "conservation" plan. I was on the MD Governer's Diamondback Task Force a few years ago, and we suggested that MD switch to a slot limit similar to NY, so that at least some of the older, bigger (and thus more productive) females wouldn't be harvested, but the Fisheries Service didn't take our suggestion. Want to change something? Start a letter writing campaign to the MD DNR asking them to adopt a slot limit for terrapin harvesting.

At least in MD you're allowed to own up to three terrapins as pets (even though a commercial fisherman can take as many as he wants so long as he reports his catch). I believe you can't have them as pets in NY?

Katrina

"What frustrates me HERE is that we have laws which strictly govern, how, when, what size and how many dbts can be harvested. I see these restrictions violated on a regular basis and nothing ever seems to get done about it.

There are supposed to be these safeguards in place. I have seen vast numbers of diamond backs way over the legal size (never under) sitting in these markets."

terpdaddy52 Jan 08, 2006 09:39 AM

Its sad, but these were actually Maryland's Turtles. The way we found out was that 3 of the 9 terrapins confiscated had been previousl tagged by my organization. Of the 3 tagged, 2 of them had escaped the soup pot 3 times already, this being their 4th. It has caused quite a stir in New York, and as a result, New York is going to Crack down on its enforcement. As far as Maryland goes, DNR still has no idea the reality of the amount of turtles being harvested each year for food markets. They look at reports from the harvester, assuming that all are honest in their harvest reports. Unfortunately, they are very far from the truth. In 2003, DBT harvesters reported 650 pounds total to the state. In actuality, my organization collected data and tagged close to 3000 individual females (only 6 were males!) and the seller told us that 3000 was about 10% of what he sold from the harvesters. At 3-4 pounds a piece, the numbers just don't match up. We will soon publish this data, and hopefully encourage MD DNR to get their act together, and not be so ignorant of the situation.

J

herpboi Jan 18, 2006 01:43 PM

I was told recently that DBT's can be owned as pets in NY... this was told to me by the owner of a semi-local exotics shop here in NY.

Does anyone know where to find out for sure if it is legal or not... I wouldn't mind having a CBB DBT for a pet.

Peace,
Jim

erico Jan 20, 2006 03:17 PM

I heard awhile back that Draconian restrictions had been placed on ALL NYC reptile ownership. Am I correct or misguided???

honuman Jan 20, 2006 04:37 PM

No Erico -

They recently imposed restrictions on Large constrictor and monitors. Not sure of the list but it was confined to those types animals.

Katrina Jan 27, 2006 04:21 PM

Don't forget that iguanas are illegal in NYC. As far as I know, other than state native animal regs, turtles are OK in NYC.
-----
1.2 Eastern Muds - Fred, Ethel, Edith
0.1 Iguana - Tiffel
0.1 Bearded Dragon - Foster
Foster turtles: More than I'd like the husband to know about.

Katrina Jan 27, 2006 04:22 PM

Don't know if this helps, but take a look. Best thing to do would be to call the DEC.

http://nytts.org/nytts/terrapin.htm

Katrina
-----
1.2 Eastern Muds - Fred, Ethel, Edith
0.1 Iguana - Tiffel
0.1 Bearded Dragon - Foster
Foster turtles: More than I'd like the husband to know about.

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