Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Im an info nut, I want as much at my disposal as possible. Not only the same old info but conflicting info as well i.e. there isnt always one way to do something etc... To my point, I have all the literature I could find (printed) as well as what I could get on the net and its not a whole lot in regards to both. So Im gonna ask you guys who have been keeping and breeding Gaigeae. Ive kept an adult pair of Gaigeae before in the 90's but I only had them for 6 months or so and I was told to keep em cool and good luck. I did breed them and they did lay eggs (for Dennis Mountain that is as I sent him a gravid female unknown to me grrrr..lol). Onto my questions and I really hope you guys give up some good basic info.

1. TEMPS, what range or gradient is best for these animals? Ive head keep em cooler and also keep like any other Colubrid.

8. MISC, Any pics of Florida Zoo stock adults around ? Whats your largest Gaigeae in your collection and how old is it ?

Thanks in advance and if any is tempted to say do a search on the forums I did and it stinks mainly because the searches are too broad and you cant specify enough. Type in Black Milksnake and you get 1000's of posts with the word black and/or Milksnake and not always together etc...

Yearling San Antonio Stock male

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Hi all,

I hope this post gets alot of response as I am interested in more info on Thease killer snakes. I have tried several substrates for my Black milks and going through aspen (too dry)
news paper (too dry and my black milks seemed more active and calmer when they could burrow in the aspen) Repti Bark (too costly and stained every thing redish brown} and then one day at the while at Home Depot remembered some on telling me that cypruss mulch was a great bedding for reptiles that like to burrow and have a liking for high humidity. I am still using the cyprus and have also found that when kept very moist it gets hot spots, not enough to heat a cage but enough to offer more heat graidents to my snakes. Again I hope that this post gets alot of response as I would love to hear what others know and have to say on thease great snakes.

Hello,
I've often perused your Eastern Kingsnake site, and I think something similar for black milks would be a great resource for the community. I did some poking around a few years ago, trying to find out information on the origins of the established lines that are available in the U.S.. John Cherry had some very good information, I'll have to dig up the e-mails he sent me and forward them to you. As I recall, all of the gaigeae in the U.S. are descended from a small number of specimens imported back in the '80s. I think the Florida Zoo line is closely related to the San Antonio Zoo line, and there are also the Mark Bell and Steve Hammack lines. Critter Connection used to work with gaigeae, and had a very good website, which can still be accessed via the Archive.org "Wayback Machine" at the link below. I'll answer the rest of your questions to the best of my ability... I'm not the most experienced herper, but I have a pair of '02s (male from the S.A. Zoo line, female from the Mark Bell line) that are doing very well, and a clutch of 6 perfect '05 hatchlings, so I suspect I'm doing something right.

Temps - if you are setting up a gradient, I'd say about 65-70 degrees on the cool side, 80-85 degrees on the warm side. My gaigeae have an 20W incandescent "puck" light above one end of their cage to provide a basking spot and illumination (so I can look at them... I'm sure they'd be perfectly happy in the dark).

Substrate - I use cypress mulch... it looks fairly naturalistic and the snakes seem to like it. I've never used anything else, so I really have no basis for comparison.

Humidity - You're probably right; their cloud forest habitat would be humid. I mist mine when they're in shed; that seems to be sufficient.

Feeding - As hatchlings, they grow very fast... about 2" per month for the first 12-18 months. During this stage, it's hard to overfeed them. As they turn black, their metabolisms slow down, as should their feeding regimen. Right now my '02 adults are getting 2 weanling rats per week, and seem to be doing well. The '05 hatchlings are eating 2-3 large mouse pinkies per week, though I think I'll be upgrading them to fuzzies soon.

Brumation - Not necessary, though apparently not harmful. If you go to a weather website and look at a high altitude location like San Jose, there is no seasonal variation in temperature... it's lows around 70, highs around 80 year round. That close to the equator, the days and nights are always about the same length, too. I didn't do anything special with my gaigeae this spring, in fact, I had planned to wait another year to breed just to be on the safe side. But, the female swelled up with ova, and the male went off feed... they were big enough, so I let them go at it. I put them together about 5 or 6 times over the course of 2 weeks, and got a perfect clutch of 6 eggs, no slugs.

Speaking of hatchlings, I have to go feed them!

Regards,
Nate

Critter Connection Gaigeae Page

Thanks ! I do remember the Critter Connection site and I appreciate the link.

Keith
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if you do dig up those Cherry emails use this addy getula70@charter.net Thanks!

Keith
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For you adventurous types, I highly recommend this place in Monteverde CR. Very inexpensive accomodations, decent hiking on private land and the Gaigae invade the houses periodically. Alan Pounds lives up the hill and if you like near extinct and obscure frogs, this is paradise found.
http://terravivacr.com/

Keith, all I can add is that moisture is an everpresent part of the environment and temps remain cool year round but when the sun burns off the mist, temps might get up to 85.
Jeff
Link

Hey Jeff

Looks like a pretty cool place to vacation, thanks for the link. Are we still on for the Black Milks ?

Keith
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