Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Here is what I have now:
1 Adult albino male (Kahl)
1 Adult Anery Female
1 Adult Hypo Female

I've got $4,000 to spend, should I purchase one of the following???????
Albino male (sharp)
Jungle male
Any other suggestions?

Also, how important is pattern when buying jungles? I've seen stripers and other that look like normal columbians. I understand that buying from a reputable dealer is the key to verifing the bloodline but is it more important to buy the bloodline or buy the pattern?

Thanks!

If you scroll down a bit, there was a nice big disscusion on the whole Sharp Albino VS. Jungle, Pretty interesting. The general consesus on here is to go with the Sharp Albino...But in my opinion...LOL I would go with a nice jungle. If I had 4g's to drop I would go with a jungle, cause Sharp Albinos are just that just an Albino...LOL.....Just joking Sharp Albino Fans...LOL...Really I was just kidden around...
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www.executivereptiles.com

I'd pick up a nice jungle male. I'm personally looking for both this season. I can also tell you that you will have a harder time finding a male Sharp albino then a male jungle. Good luck.
Michael Burton
Here is a pick of my Sharp albino

Breed teh Jungle male to your Salmon female. Salmon Jungles go for 6-10k each, and If you had bought a male sharp, the DH sunglows would be the best you could make your first breeding and they only sell for 2500-3000. That is a big price drop.

Good Luck,
Mark

It really cracks me up that I have seen several people come on, wanting to know which is better, and right away they seem like they already know which one they want...Sharp Albino...But they need reassurance that they are making the right choice...That shows me something, that If I need help making the choice about the sharp albino, maybe they are not as "HOT" as everyone is making them out to be? You don't see many people saying "Should I spend the money and buy a jungle? Its always the Sharps vs. something else...

Just what I have been noticing....And just my OPINION...LOL
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www.executivereptiles.com

I think its funny how some of you guys are so stuck on the sharp strain....NEwsFlash, just in, ITS JUST AN ALBINO. Comparing it to a Jungle is silly, there is no comparison, Jungles are by far, the better investment.

I agree, they are just an albino, and its true they do hold their color better into adulthood, and adult sharps look fantastic, but I too get a chuckle out of all the "Hype" the Sharp Albinos are getting. AGAIN just my opinion, I know this forum is full of Sharp Albino Keepers and breeders...Just giving my opinion...I would take a Nice Jungle over a Sharp Albino anyday. I think when more super jungles are available that will fuel the jungle market even more. And just like with the Hypos, I think Jungles too can be refined and made to look ten times better than they do now, with selective breeding, to produce the best of the best. Good luck picking which one to drop your money on...But as the previous poster that asked pertty much the same question, do I sense that you have already made your mind and wanted people to assure you that getting a sharp albino was the way to go??? Thats what happened in the last thread, I still say Jungle...LOL
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www.executivereptiles.com

You don't work with them. Why would you tell someone to make an investment in them if you only sell Kahls?

You assume everyone is money-driven. A poor assumption IMO.

I have absolutely no Sharp strain in my collection (I will one day) yet I tell people all the time that they are a great investment and I highly reccomend them.

Your assuming something about me. This entire debate is about which is a better investment, so money does have something to do with it.
Michael Burton

1. Someone reccomends jungle over sharp

2. You say the only reason he says so is because he only works with Kahl.

You really dont see the parrallel of your assumption? There are various reasons he could have reccomended the jungle but you chose to assume it was only because of his own money driven greed as a pose to actual non-biased advice (based on those various other reasons). I'm not assuming anything, just calling it as it is.

Like I said before the question was about which is a better investment. That meens money. Why would someone recommend a Sharp albino boa when they only work with Kahls. It just makes sense that he kept agreeing that a jungle was a better investment. And yes, I was assuming he was talking about money, thats because he said "which would be a better investment?" I don't think it was a poor assumtion at all. You might understand my point a little better if you read all of the threads above if you havn't already.
Michael Burton

I guess your refering to me when you say some people are just stuck on Sharps. But if you think its just as easy to find a male Sharp albino as a jungle male, you are definately wrong. Don't want to argue with you, but I think a lot of breeders would agree with me on this one. I have nothing against jungles, in fact I am going to get one next year. I just think its alot harder to find a male Sharp. Well it took me three years anyway.
Michael Burton

I have had no trouble finding sharp albino males from several different sources for several years now. I work with both sharp and kahl stock. I also work with jungles and can assure you that Jungle males are every bit as hard to find as Sharp albino males, and are almost twice the price.

I saw jungles this year go for $3500. Pete Kahl had a male jungle on his site about six months ago for $2500. So I don't know where your getting this almost double the price from. Do you mind me asking where you found your Sharps last year and the year before? The way your making it sound is there was plenty to go around. From what I could tell, the only people who got males were people on waiting lists. I did see Bob Clack post some for sale. I'm pretty sure he sold his entire litter in two days which tells me they are pretty hot. I contacted many breeders including Mike W. Bob C. Rich I. Brian S Chuck T. Ron M. and others trying to track down a male Sharp and like I said it took me three seasons. And the only reason I got one is because Brandon for Summit Reptiles was nice enough to sell me his that he bought earlier. Anyway, I am just posting the experience I had find my male Sharp. I just find it hard to believe that finding a male Sharp albino is easier than finding a male jungle. Hopefully someone will agree. Good luck this season Mark.

I found an 03 male sharp albino last season at a year old on KS classified for 2500, it was listed for a month at least before i bought it, was produced by Nick the "boa aficianado" as well as this season I bought a male from Mike Combs and if I had wanted, I could have bought males from several different sources, the boabasement, salmonboa, and others who listed them, and there is no chortage of them in Europe if you want to import one.

Thanks Mike,

I hope your season is a good one as well!

Mark

Ruben Michel

Now compare that price with a male jungle with decent abberancies, all of mine sold for 3500-4500.

That is a nice Jungle Celia has even without the abberencies, i gaurantee it wont last long for that price, I also noticed it was only posted for sale this last week so it hasnt been available very long.

Cant wait to see those Jungles this season!

same price and in some cases cheaper(Pete Kahl)and if you really want to compare the facts you guys are debating, I can find 3 jungle males in the classifieds and only one sharp male.
Hmmmmmm. and cause you'll mostlikely ask who, here they are, Ian(SELECT REPS) Celia(EBN)and the guy thats selling the male and female imported from Sweden. Sorry but I forgot his name.

Ruben Michel

The one you saw in his website for 2.5k (the one I bought), was the last one sold at that price. He told me on the phone when it came time to ship that they had gone up in value and he was raising his prices. So, at least at this point in time, you cant get a jungle from Kahl for cheaper.
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Take Care,

-Ryan Homsey

www.topnotchboas.com

Ya, but we were talking about this past season.

I just talked to Pete Kahl and he said he has some male jungles for $3500. So I don't know where your getting this $5000 price from. Hopefully they are pretty clean b/c I'm planning on getting one.
Michael Burton

fluctuating.

I have a friend who purchased multiple jungles from pete at the 5k price tag 3 or 4 months ago. And that was what Pete told me on the phone when I was getting my jungle (along with a few other boas) shipped. Granted, that was around 6 months ago.

Supply and Demand dictates everything.

If the supply of sharps were so low, it seems like their price would be higher than 2 to 2.5k as neos. Either A. There is a low supply of them and the demand is low or B. There isnt as low of a supply of them as suggested and the demand is where it would be expected to be. I honestly dont know which it is. Jungles demand a higher price because there is a higher demand for them (and likely a higher supply).

Where have you seen a Sharp go for $2000. From what I have seen they go for $2500-$3000. I'm sorry you feel this debate is retarded. I just don't like hearing things like Sharps have brown, male Sharps are easier to find than male jungles, and so on. I feel that these statements are not true and I am just defending and sticking up for a project that I love, sorry if thats retarded to you.
Michael Burton

I dont recall exactly where I saw a sharp albino for 2k. I believe it was on kingsnake but I could be mistaken on that (both on where I saw it and that I saw one for 2k).

Ya know, I think sharp albinos may be undervalued. If they go so quickly and are so rare ... with people having to search them out ... that market dictates a price increase. Why hasnt it?

Nice jungles to demand a price of 5k currently so obviously the market is better for them. It's real simple to determine the market potential of anything, look at the value!

Three years ago when I started searching for Sharp albinos they went from $1200-$1500 and sometimes $2000. I know this because I just found the original piece of paper I used to keep records of different breeders and prices. Now, three years later people are selling out of them with a price of $2750-$3000. Now granted if its a lower end animal they don't always fly off the rack. But it seems to me the price has increased over the years do to higher demand. I will agree though that it seems that the Sharp sunglows aren't as easy to sell. I would rather produce 4 Sharp albinos then one Sharp sunglow (unless it was amazing, of course). It seems no one has a problem selling out of normal Sharps.
Michael Burton

Ya, I don't know how you can say that jungle males go for almost double Sharp males. It doesn't matter weather they have high abberencies or not. You can still produce high abberant jungles from one of those normal looking jungles. And lets see this upcoming season how many male jungles will be in the classifieds and how many male Sharps. I will put money on the outcome. Mark, can you list what breeders produced and sold male Sharps on kingsnake this past season?
Michael Burton

Mike combs produced and sold male sharp albinos on KS
Ron Michelotti had some, dont recall if he had males listed on the ad or not.
Rich Ihle has had some and listed them on KingSnake.
A guy from Europe earlier in the season listed some on Kingsnake, but i dont recall his name.
The boa basement had some for sale and listed them.
I know i am forgetting somone but it is late and im tired...

Boa basement only posted sunglows no male Sharp albino.
Mike I think only posted one
And I believe Ron M didn't post any male Sharp albinos on kingsnake.
So that leaves one from Mike C., a few from Rich, maye some from a guy in europe, and some from Bob clack not too many in my book. And why did the prices of jungles jump in the middle of this past season. I thought the super jungle was first produced a while ago. Mark,
one more thing. If you put that amazing salmon from rich with one of you jungles I will be first in line to get one. The offspring would be out of this world. Let me know what your plans are for that salmon girl.
Mike Burton

Interesting topic.
I think jungle, sharp albinos are all no brainers for making your money back, if thats what your into it for.
I actually sold 6 sharp albinos, I didnt advertise them that long, because I did not have to, they went like hot cakes... not too mention a holdback I had someone offered me double for that...
Of course I kept it and the sunglows.
The dh's I still have 2 pair, they were sold with deposits put down, but people change thier mind. Im not pressed... I dont breed what i cant feed.
I dont think you can go wrong with either trait, jungle or sharp albino. Im sure other people, like myself are in this for the long haul and its not just a fleeting passion.
So there is plenty of time to get all of them and have fun with mixing them all up and seeing what comes out.
Back in 2000 when I bought my sharp albino female, it wasnt as popular as now,people made remarks , oh everyone is using Kahl strain... well thats what made me get a sharp... that and the fact they look completly differant as adults etc. They hold color way better.
I also, knew I was going to end up making sunglows with her, that was the 2nd reason I got her. Now that I have sharp sunglows, I go to what "I" want next..I'll probally get a salmon jungle het sharp..motley het sharp...something along those lines to breed to her and my female sharp sunglow.
I have seen killer kahl strain albinos, and there are plent nice combos out there with them, but I wanted to take a road less traveled back then, and now it seems to have paid off.

As far as price goes, the market will dictate that... its America, thats what its all about.

Have fun.. I know I do..

Mike
Thats ruby at two years old

As far as a jungle goes,the whole pattern thing is mostly what your preference is. A jungle with no major pattern going on will still produce heavy patterned babies. My 04 male has a stripe thats is just about the whole length of his body and his dad had a normal pattern. So you will get all ranges of pattern when breeding even a normal looking jungle. Who you get it from is the most important thing to me. You can't go wrong with the Sharp male and thats what i'd go with.

Ruben Michel

Easy choice for that money ! You allready have an albinos male, a Kahl and they have now proved that they can be stunning adults, so why go to the Sharp ? You know why I think that there is no need to go on the sharps !
A jungle male, as a co-dom, can breed for you very fast and give you jungle salmon for exemple and you can even buy some normal females for an extra jungle litter !

I agree completely
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0.1 wife
0.4 kids
2.0 kids
0.1 columbian redtail (gravid) 6ft
1.0 pastel 6 1/2 ft
1.0 burmese 10ft
1.0 redtail baby
0.1 surinam(purple)
50 rats
3.4 dwarf hamsters
1.1 dogs
0.2 farret
8.24 mice
1.0 guinie pig
0.2 cats

np
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1.1.0 Colombian Redtail Boa
2.1.0 Sumatran Blood Pythons
1.0 Black Blood Python
1.0 Dumeril's Boa
0.1 Coastal Carpet Python
0.1 Jungle Carpet Python
1.0 Texas Tiger Salamander

thats to much Jungle all the way,,,~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~:}~
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Forever Trust in what we are,and nothing else Matters

so, if he wants on his bridge he'll have to pay you. hehehe
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1.1.0 Colombian Redtail Boa
2.1.0 Sumatran Blood Pythons
1.0 Black Blood Python
1.0 Dumeril's Boa
0.1 Coastal Carpet Python
0.1 Jungle Carpet Python
1.0 Texas Tiger Salamander

ok, anyone remember the World Series of Dice on Chapelle Show Season 2?

When they ask 'Gritz n Gravy' how he spent the millions he won is his last tournament?

He said," I bought my momma a new car, and I spent the rest on...... PCP!"

*ROFLMAO*

Ok, maybe it was just me that found that funny...

lol
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Thanks and take care - Joe Rollo
'Tis not the stongest of the species that will eventually survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change' Charles Darwin

hey thats not a bad idea. just think of all the morph ideas you could come up with while trippin on some acid. (maybe i need to contact some of these high dollar breeders and find out what they did in college).
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1.1.0 Colombian Redtail Boa
2.1.0 Sumatran Blood Pythons
1.0 Black Blood Python
1.0 Dumeril's Boa
0.1 Coastal Carpet Python
0.1 Jungle Carpet Python
1.0 Texas Tiger Salamander