Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Is there any type or species of snake that could be kept outdoors and thrive?

i live in san diego and the temperatures at there coldest reach freezing and that is only at night...i would provide heating to keep them warm.

the reason why i ask if there is a snake that can be kept outdoors is because my mom will not allow a snake indoors....none in the grage none in my room...only outdoors..

THANKS IN ADVANCE!
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eric

When I was still at home, my mom started charging me rent when I got my first snake. How old are you? Is she afraid of snakes? Snakes are cold blooded, and need some external heat source. I would not chance keeping a sanke outdoors because more than likely, it would not survive. You would not enjoy your snake anyway if it was kept outside. See if your mom will let you get a book so you can learn about them for when you do get one someday. Maybe you can teach your mom about them, too. If she learns about them, then maybe she'll come around. Good Luck, Derek

Probably wouldn't work, unless you put down a few grand for some problem solving engineering.

Besides requiring heating when it's cool, snakes also require the option of crawling somewhere cool if it's too hot. Overheating is just as dangerous for a snake as getting cold. They need a nice consistent temperature gradient all the time so they can choose what they need.

And there's also the caging concern. Most species appropriate for novices, are relatively little, diameter wise anyway. If you kept him in a glass or plastic aquarium, it could swiftly overheat and kill him. And it would be extremely difficult to cool. If you arranged a wire mesh cage, he could escape, strangle himself or rub his nose raw. And it wouldn't hold in humidity or warmth.

For the snake's sake, you'd be best off waiting till you're out of the house, acquiring another type of reptile your mother would be more comfortable with, or negotiating big time for a cage in your room.

Many types of (indoor) caging are well made and nearly escape-proof, when tended to properly. Maybe you could research different kinds of caging, find a really high quality type and offer to put a lock on it as well?

Eh, also copy and paste in www.anapsid.org which has tons of articles on reptiles you could find useful.
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0.1 chickens (Condor)
0.2 dog mutts (half ownership, only mine when they misbehave, Lucy & Amy)
0.1 Halflinger horse (Crissy)
0.1 Normal phase California Kingsnake (Sophia)
1.1 parents
Still searching for 1.0 WC human

maybe a gopher snake or bullsnake. Even a kingsnake is pretty hardy....If the cage is kept out of the sun in summer and let the snake cool in winter in a well insulated bin. Maybe with a UTH under it to keep temps stable..Im thinking San Diego temps are rather milds all year around..It would take work but I think it could be done..You would definitely have to establish your enclosure first before getting any animal.. Starting in winter and through summer to figure out the temp extremes and how to correct them..It all boils down to how bad you want a snake and how much work your willing to put into it..
Maybe your mom would let you keep a lizard in the house, some people dont find them as creepy..
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But if you put a glass tank outside, it acts like a green house and will very quickly overheat and kill anything in it.
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0.1 Irian Jaya carpet python
1.0 Hogg Island Boa
0.1 Ball python
1.3 Crested Geckos (harlequin/fire, dalmatian, fire)
4.6.0 Leopard Geckos (nrml, abno, htct, blz, lcs)
0.1 Western Hognose snake
1.0 Albino Lavender California Kingsnake
1.3 Bearded Dragons
0.2 Water turtles
0.0.1 Rose Haired Tarantula-Sammy
1.0 Umbrella Cockatoo (belongs to my mom and I)

There's a guy who posts mostly on the indigo forum, and goes under the name Sighthunter, and I believe he keeps several snakes in outdoor enclosures. If you're serious about doing it, go to the indigo forum, find one of his posts, and email him (click on his name), and he would probably be willing to tell you how it's done.

Eric,

I don't think this is a good idea. You are much better of trying slowly to decrease your mother's irrational fear (don't tell her it's irrational!).

Keeping a snake in a cage outside might work in a mild winter, but in the summer, the cage would almost certainly get too hot. If the sun shone on it, even for a few minutes, I could kill your snake very quickly.
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Chris Harrison
San Antonio, Texas

Well,

Chrish you could definately be right! I am not sure of considering keeping one at all if the animal would be at a danger of dying...

Thanks for telling me that though....
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eric

lol...there's a good chance your mom is young enough to be my daughter, so here's a bit of advice. Don't even try keeping one outside. It's not worth the effort and the odds are good the animal will either escape or die. As suggested, try a lizard (no, not a monitor), and just work on her slowly and rationally. Get someone who's opinion she respects to help...and when the day finally comes, be prepared for it to escape Did that to my mom, and she actually used a pair of tongs I had to put the escapee back in the cage. Never mind the fact she put a yellow rat snake in the Florida king's cage....her heart was in the right place. Yes, I got home from school in time to remove 5" of rat snake from the kingsnake. Rat snake recovered, but was much more docile...
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1.1 Blackheaded pythons
1.1 Woma (Juvie female)
2.1 Aussie Olives
1.1 Timors
1.0 Angolan Juvie
1.1 Savu
1.1 Juvie Bloods
1.1 Juvie Balls
1.1 IJ Carpets
1.1 Coastal Carpets
1.2 Macklotts
1.1 Papuan Olives
1.0 Jungle Carpet
2.2 Scrubs (on breeding loan)
0.1 Jungle/Diamond cross
0.1 child, CB
0.1 wife, WC

Dude im no freakin ameture! I have kept CWDs, frillies, Mellers and panther chams, beardies, leaf tails, and leos....i hav experience!

Dont imply because im young i dont know jack crap about herps!

I have done research on keeping snakes outside and have discovered that it DEFINATELY could work, but it is too time consuming and risky...
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eric

Eric, I don't believe that Jaykis intended to insult you. He merely gave sound basic advice and offered a personal anecdote.

When we address someone on the forum we don't know, that's the thing. We know nothing about the person! So a few pointers you may not appreciate. First, when introducing yourself, clarify your current experience level. Second, people (unjustly or not) judge a person by their appearance. In person this means how they dress. On the net, this means spelling and punctuation. Third, flaming up a storm over an unintended or imagined slight never gets the desired effect.

My cranky little lecture over, I have two more thoughts. I'm glad you're passing on the snake for now till you're in a better position. And if you're allright with a display-only animal, would your mother be able to stomach having a legless lizard in the house? It may help her perspective, assuming it's a species that interests you.
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0.1 chickens (Condor)
0.2 dog mutts (half ownership, only mine when they misbehave, Lucy & Amy)
0.1 Halflinger horse (Crissy)
0.1 Normal phase California Kingsnake (Sophia)
1.1 parents
Still searching for 1.0 WC human

Eric my boy...calm down. I was in your situation once, too. While I find it interesting, at the age of 58, to be called "Dude", I'm sure you have "some" experience, as I did at that age....but if you're not even out of the parent's house, there's only so much experience you can have, as you realize by asking the question you did. I was trying to tell you how to convert your mom over to your way of thinking, but evidently you don't need my advice. I used to keep my animals outside at my parents house during the summer (Maryland), but moved them in when it got cold.

But...you seen to have all the answers, so you don't need any advice from me. Good luck...you're gonna need it
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1.1 Blackheaded pythons
1.1 Woma (Juvie female)
2.1 Aussie Olives
1.1 Timors
1.0 Angolan Juvie
1.1 Savu
1.1 Juvie Bloods
1.1 Juvie Balls
1.1 IJ Carpets
1.1 Coastal Carpets
1.2 Macklotts
1.1 Papuan Olives
1.0 Jungle Carpet
2.2 Scrubs (on breeding loan)
0.1 Jungle/Diamond cross
0.1 child, CB
0.1 wife, WC

Sorry for freakin out man!

I just hate people judging me cause of my age! I have tons of experience for someone my age and so does my dad....

Well a legless lizard bothers her to! Man WTF!!!! At the last IRBA show we went to she held a baby ball python! why wont she justy let me get one then!!!

PSH! Moms...think they rule the world!

Ah well thanks for the help dudes!

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eric

No problem, I get snarly too.

No legless lizards, hmm. I guess you could get a skink and work your way to more vestigial legged species, but that would be kinda epic and with no promise of working.

Just thinking, could it be that she has a problem with the food source, believing they need to be fed live food, or having a problem with mousicles in the freezer? Just my last two guesses. Good luck.
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0.1 chickens (Condor)
0.2 dog mutts (half ownership, only mine when they misbehave, Lucy & Amy)
0.1 Halflinger horse (Crissy)
0.1 Normal phase California Kingsnake (Sophia)
1.1 parents
Still searching for 1.0 WC human

That was possibly the most retarded reply I've ever read. Good job trying to convince people you aren't an "ameture".
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0.1 Irian Jaya carpet python
1.0 Hogg Island Boa
0.1 Ball python
1.3 Crested Geckos (harlequin/fire, dalmatian, fire)
4.6.0 Leopard Geckos (nrml, abno, htct, blz, lcs)
0.1 Western Hognose snake
1.0 Albino Lavender California Kingsnake
1.3 Bearded Dragons
0.2 Water turtles
0.0.1 Rose Haired Tarantula-Sammy
1.0 Umbrella Cockatoo (belongs to my mom and I)

I know a guy who keeps a corn snake in a screened porch area in Louisiana. As far as I can tell, he's doing several things wrong, but so far, he's not had any problem. He uses some kind of hot rock for a heat source. I know that practice is completely wrong for snakes, but it's worked for him so far. Even when the temperature drops into the 20's in the winter, the snake can curl in a cave part of the hot rock and survive. I think he just unplugs the hot rock in the summer. We get temperatures in the 90's during the day, but I guess the porch doesn't get much hotter than 90. I'd never keep a snake that way, but it works for him so far.

If you put enough effort into setting up your cage, you could probably make it work, but the expense both in setting up and maintaining the cage would probably be more trouble than you'd want right now. If you built a box around your cage and heated both the box and the cage, you could probably keep temperatures warm enough in the winter. I'd probably buy a nice commercial cage made of plastic and use undertank heating. The cage would need some ventilation on the sides as well as the top. I'd then build a wooden box around the cage with about four to six inches of airspace on the top and sides of the cage. I'd get two or three lamps that are made to be weather resistant and put 150 to 200 watt bulbs in the lamps. I'd have enough room underneath the cage to put the lamps so that they are about eight or ten inches from the cage bottom. I'd put an aquarium in the bottom as well, keep it filled with water, and add an aquarium heater to keep the water as warm as possible (at least 80°F and no more than 100°F). You'd have to experiment with the number of lamps and the wattage of the bulbs to keep the temperature between the wooden box and the cage at around 70 degrees. You'd want the lamps controlled on a simple on/off thermostat to be absolutely sure of this temperature. The point of having the aquarium full of heated water is to keep enough humidity in the box that the air warmed by the lamps doesn't dry your cage too much. For good measure, I'd have the UTH on a separate thermostat from the lights.

If the ideas in the previous paragraph worked, you might be okay for the winter. For the summer, you'd need a different strategy. You'd need to build some kind of shelter so that the sun wouldn't hit your cage directly. If the sun beat on the cage, the heat would be too much. If you could keep the cage shaded, you might be able to keep the cage cool enough with some kind of forced evaporation setup. You'd need to be able to attach an absorbent cloth to the cool side of the cage and maybe to part of the top of the cage. You'd then need some device that would flow enough water onto the cloth to keep the entire cloth damp. To save water and avoid dripping on other parts of the system, I wouldn't want to flow so much water that it was constantly dripping from the bottom of the cloth. However, if you flowed enough water, you might be able to cool the cage that way. For more cooling, you'd need a fan that would blow on the cloth. The heat of evaporation of water is pretty high, so the evaporation that you force by blowing air across the damp cloth should remove a good amount of heat from the cage. Again, I'd want the whole system on a thermostat to turn off the fans and the water at night if they worked too well. You wouldn't want your snake to be too cold in the summer.

I've never tried to do anything this elaborate or heard of anyone else trying it. I think each of these ideas should work. The cost would be pretty big, and the electricity required to run these devices would be an ongoing cost. If San Diego has power shortages the way that the rest of California has sometimes, I wouldn't risk an animal in this setup. Likewise, if water shortages might cause some local government to make you turn off the water, you shouldn't try this setup.

Personally, I'd wait if I were you. I wanted a snake from the time that I was about seven, but I didn't buy my first one until I was 42. Waiting a few more years won't hurt you. I found that earning a couple of engineering degrees and getting a job negates parental objections.

Good luck,

Bill
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It's not how many snakes you have. It's how happy and healthy you can keep them.

Where do you live? If you live north of the carolinas then don't even try it.

Offer to clean your own room from now on and keep the snake under our bed (if the cage will fit) or in your closet. Also, if you have a large basement or attic you could hide the snake there instead.

I'd be getting dad to work on mom.....and that's as much as I'll say about that
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1.1 Blackheaded pythons
1.1 Woma (Juvie female)
2.1 Aussie Olives
1.1 Timors
1.0 Angolan Juvie
1.1 Savu
1.1 Juvie Bloods
1.1 Juvie Balls
1.1 IJ Carpets
1.1 Coastal Carpets
1.2 Macklotts
1.1 Papuan Olives
1.0 Jungle Carpet
2.2 Scrubs (on breeding loan)
0.1 Jungle/Diamond cross
0.1 child, CB
0.1 wife, WC