Reptile & Amphibian Forums

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NICK

24leos - 4 eggs incubating

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Leopard Gecko Genetics Calculator

You can figure out the genetics of most simple recessive traits yourself using a Punnets square (this will not work for blazing Blizzards or line breed traits) If you wanted to know what you would get if you breed two normal het for patternless leos first you would give normal the variable N and Patternless the lowercase variable p. It doesn’t matter what the variables are but it is simpler to make the recessive traits lowercase. Then draw a Punnets square and put the first variable (N) of one gecko above the top left box and the second variable (p) above the right box on top. Now do the same with the other gecko’s variables on the left side of the square. Finally move the variable on the top left down into both left boxes and do the same with the other variables so that each box has two letters in it. NN means normal Np means normal het for patternless and pp means patternless. Now that you have approximated the number of patternless babies to be ¼ do the same with Normal geckos het for albino using a as the variable for albino. You should get a solution much like the first one with ¼ being albino. To calculate the number of patternless albinos you would get from breeding double hets simply multiply ¼ by ¼ to get 1/16. This tells you one out of every sixteen babies should statistically be a patternless albino. I know this seems difficult but if you still don’t understand find someone to explain it to you more clearly.

N p N a
N NN Np N NN Na
p Np pp a Na aa

because the Tremper Patternless Albinos are just as if not harder to produce then blazing blizzards. The two genes just seem to be very tough to combine and after four years of the Tremper Albino being available and more for the patternless, we are just now seeing Tremper Patternless Albinos available, and from only one breeder, Garrick at CrestedGecko.com. But you can expect a lot of normals, and some equal numbers of patternless and albino, with all of them being 66% het for what ever gene isn't expressed.
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Bradley Baquial

If I'm not mistaken VMS Herp has also had luck in producing the Tremper Patternless albino. Garrick also states (in the classifieds with his tremper patternless albinos) that he produced one patternless albino out of the 150 babies that the first double hets produced, this patternless albino was a male. So in my eyes they aren't as hard to produce as the blazing blizzards are since your hearing a ratio of 1:1000 or even 1:2000 with the blazings... The Tremper Patternless albinos are hard to produce, but I think you'd have better luck creating these then you would a blazing blizzard... Just my opinion though...

Richie

Bradley said that the one person offering them for SALE was Garrick DeMeyer, not the only person with them. Garrick is offering them for I think about $450. Also, there are probably more blazings then there are Tremper PA's. Of course I dont know this for sure, but I heard there are around 80 or so blazings, and I dont think there are that many Tremper PA's. Though I may be wrong.
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Josh
My Email

Josh,

You seem to have misunderstood my post... Its not like I was trying to call Brad a liar... I wouldnt do that. I simply said that VMS herp also produced them (PA's). Never once did I say they were selling them. As far as the Blazings are concerned, your right we have no way of knowing how many Patterless albinos are in existence... Could be more, could be less then anyone thinks...No one knows. For all we know many unknown breeders could have also produced the Tremper Patternless albinos and they're just keeping them under wraps until they have enough to post for sale... Only time will tell. I simply stated that Blizzards (blazings) seem to be harder to produce ratio wise... This way just my opinion... AS I STATED in the previous post. And Brad, for the record, I wasn't trying to make you look doubted... So dont think I was.

Richie

K&N Reptiles posted hear about a year ago about how over two seasons they had hatched over 1000 babies from a double het to double het breeding and did not get one Tremper Patternless Albino, I found it in the archives a while back (I was bored). Albey also had a large group of double hets and did not hatch a single Tremper Patternless Albino.

I think Garrick simply got lucky, and do remember he did try breeding the double hets a few years earlyer and did not get any Patternless Albinos (If you already incorperated that, then nevermind that). Some people could get one 1:150 others will get one at a 1:2000 ratio, its all in the luck of the draw. And with that in my opinion Tremper Patternless Albinos are just as hard to produce Blazings.
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Bradley Baquial

Hey Bradley,

I agree with you 100%... I think there is alot of luck involved with both the Blazing Blizzards, and the Tremper Patternless Albinos... But thats okay with me... I think its the luck of the draw part that keeps us all in the breeding circle... I know I dont have the room to house 2000 - 3000 lizards that were all the result of double het breedings. So maybe that luck'll pass on to one of us... Who knows, maybe one of us small time breeders will be the next one to hatch out one of these very sought after animals... Who knows??? Stranger things have happened... Just hope it continues on that path...

Richie

Well, you must've mis-understood my post as well. I wasnt trying to attack you, though it might of seemed as I was. It is hard to express tones over the net or in writing so please dont take my post the wrong way. I, in no way, thought you were calling him a liar. From reading your post, it sounded as though you had thought Bradley said the only person with them was Garrick when what he really said was that the only person selling them was Garrick.
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Josh
My Email

Hey,

No problem Josh... I agree, I think it was just a misunderstanding of tones on both of our behalfs. Your right it is hard to express tone over the net.. Heeh alright impossible to express tone over the net... So, dont think that I was attacking you either. I was just trying to clear things up. Its all good...

Richie

>>Hey,
>>
>>No problem Josh... I agree, I think it was just a misunderstanding of tones on both of our behalfs. Your right it is hard to express tone over the net.. Heeh alright impossible to express tone over the net... So, dont think that I was attacking you either. I was just trying to clear things up. Its all good...
>>
>>Richie
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Josh
My Email

they are only 2 years old.
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NICK

26leos - 4 eggs incubating

Sorry if I misled anyone with my earlier post I simply wanted to help people firgure out genetics on their own but I was unaware tremper patternless albinos were that much harder to produce then las vegas patternless albinos. I wanted to know if there are any visual differences between rainwater and tremper PA's from the pictures I've seen they appear similar. Though they are all beautiful animals I have trouble understanding why the Trempers are a hundred dollars more then the rainwaters. I understand this is because of the more work involved by the breeders but will people really be willing to pay an extra hundred dollars for rarity. I have trouble seeing the tremper PA market going very far because of difficulty to produce and after the initial boom low demands. What are your opinions sorry for another long post I just don't know when to shut up