Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I acquired a pair of spotted turtles ten days ago. The female is thriving and eating virgirously. The male appears to be increasingly listless and I have only seen him half heartedly eat a meal worm. I have offered earth worms, feeders, and trout chow with no success. Help!

Are they in the same enclosure? Are there any other signs? Puffy eyes, nose bubbles, loud breathing, loose stools...stuff like that?

Seperate them asap. Place him in about three inches of water and add two tea bags for every ten gallons of water. Make sure he has a warm basking site and throw in a few rosie reds or minnows. Keep us posted,
Tom

I do not have a trained eye but I would say the eyes are puffy. He also opens up his mouth once in a while which the female does not do.

He is in the same tank with the female, a waterland tub. I put him in the water yesterday and he did scramble right up the ramp, which surprised me. Once he is on land, he does not move.

You need to take this animal to a qualified vet. It is very possible that the animal has an upper respiratory infection, which is only treatable with proper antibiotics. Even if this is not the case, a vet should evaluate it. They can give supportive care such as fluids and vitamin/mineral injections, even steroids. If the animal will hardly move, there isn't much chance in getting it to eat. It needs nutritional therapy at least.

Spotted turtles are very sensitive to high temperatures. In transit, temperatures can often get dangerously high. What were the conditions upon arrival? Don't tell me, but if you noticed anything mention it to the vet.

I agree that he should be taken to a vet but in the mean time I am telling you TEA BAGS IN HIS WATER!!! I was buying wild caught spotteds in the mid 90s and had this problem more than once. I was told by someone who is now lead keeper of reptiles at a zoo to do the following.
1 Place tea bags in the water.
2 Put in a few rosies.
3 Give them a warm basking site.
4 Keep them solitary.
I have also found that if you crush up vitamin c pills and place the powder in the water this helps. Also buy some tetracycline for the water. Try to feed him worms after a few days. I have had w.c. spotteds not eat for weeks and weeks and one day they get better. I don't want you to try my method and have you male die but this has worked for me more than once.

P.S.
I was buying wild caught spotteds in the 1990s and paid the price. I was paying $150 a pair and more than a few died. This method worked but to little to late for some. Now being wiser I know c.b. spotted turtles do a million times better. Take the time to grow you spotteds and you will reap the rewards.
Tom

You were right on. I actually took him in this morning and the vet gave him antibiotic shot, fluids, and vitamin A shot. He was amazingly active at the vet, given his lethargic nature here. I have to give antibiotic shots every three days for three weeks. She also said if he does not start to eat in five days, to bring him back in. I have seen some open mouth breathing and his eyes were swollen, so I think pnemonia is probably the right diagnose.

The vet recommended adding greens to the diet, e.g. kale and spinach to help with the vitamin A. Do your spotteds eat greens? She also recommended trout chow (which my turtles will not touch) and live prey...which the female loves and I assume the male will once he recovers. She also recommended dusting the prey in vitamins once a week.

The vet thinks the male was sick before I received him.

Vet also recommended UVB lamp and taking the turtles out in the sun for 10 - 15 minutes at a time. Said I should have UVB lamp plus a lamp that will maintain temperature at 85 - 95 degrees at basking area.

Bought a wet/dry vac which was phenomenal...makes cleaning a lot easier.

Any comments on her recommendations?

Spotteds may nibble on greens, but not really consume them with any regularity. The best way to fortify their diet is to feed them gut loaded critters. You may not be able to feed your turtle greens, but you can feed the crickets, mealworms, superworms, silkworms, beetles, slugs, and snails kale and such. That way, your turtles are actually getting the greens via the feeders. Dusting is not very effective for Spotteds since they only eat underwater. Feed your turtle a staple of high quality turtle food (Reptomin, Zoomed, Mazuri). Trout chow is ok, but the turtle food supplies Vit. A in the correct amounts for turtles (as we understand currently). Trout chow is cheap, but I'd go with aquatic turtle food. Supplement the diet with fish, tadpoles from very clean water, and pinkies. You shouldn't have vitamin problems with a varied diet of high quality items.

Yes, yes, yes...UVA/UVB bulbs!!! We can't stress this enough for EVERY type of turtle, even stinkpots and snappers just in case! The basking spot sounds good. I'm trying to remember all of your questions.

Watch your female turtle closely for signs of illness!

As for Spottedturtleman's suggestions, I can only comment on what I know. If this has worked for him and his friends, great. I used to take Spotted turtles from a swamp behind my house when I was a kid. The water was deeply tannin-stained and highly acidic. There is no doubt that these turtles thrive in this type of water. I would keep the turtles for a summer and let them go before school started...I know, the follies of youth. They never showed any signs of ill effects from plain tapwater, but I only kept them for a short time. Just be very careful that you don't make the water too acidic. I used to keep a fish tank of very delicate South American fish. I used to use "blackwater extract" from any fish supply store to lower the pH "naturally". That way, you can avoid caffeine, pesticides, and some alkaloids that may be present in the tea. Who knows, maybe the caffeine is what pepped the turtles up ? Good luck Paul!

The best way to acidify the water is with peat moss. This is what is found in the spotted turtles natural habitat. I fill a five gallon bucket 1/4 full of dry peat moss and fill it the rest of the way with water. This I let soak a few days then pour through a screen into the turtle tank. Or you can fill a nylon stocking with peat moss and anchor it in the turtles water.

YES! I forgot about peat. They actually have peat pellets that you can purchase at decent pet stores. The packaging can tell you almost exactly the quantity to get the desired pH.

They sound alot better than tea bags! lol. I hope you male gets better and your female stays healthy paul.
Tom

Thanks for everyone's advice.

I am on my way to buy a five gallon bucket and peat pellets. Sounds like a good idea. What is the right ph level for these guys?

I gave my male is second injection yesterday. He has gone from spending almost all day on land to all day in the water. Not sure what that means. I still have not seen him eat, but he is active at times.

The female has a big-time appetite and is doing great.

I was told these turtles were c.b., but I do not think the male was - his shell has a lot of wear and tear.

I think 6.5 is the optimal ph.
Tom

Ditto, I wouldn't go much below that. It does get lower in the wild, but that doesn't mean it's the best. The turtles have a lot of other options in the wild.

STupid question, but....am I using peat to lower the PH to 6.5 or raise it to 6.5?

I bought the 5 gallon buckets and have water soaking in peat right now.

Lower. Typical tapwater has a pH between 7 and 7.5. In certain areas, wellwater can be acidic.

Zoomed had a 5.0 and 10.0 UVB bulb. Which one should I purchase?

It depends on how far from the basking spot you are going to put the bulb. Go to the Zoomed website. They'll tell you. I think the 5.0 is only effective at less than 12 or 18 inches, and the 10.0 is effective at up to like 24 inches. Double check. I bought the 10.0 because I'm keeping my bulbs about 14 inches away. I'd rather be safe than sorry. None of these bulbs can even come close to the sun except for the mercury vapor bulbs and other $400 units.

Update on my male turtle.

The news is perplexing. He does not move at all, yet his eyes have cleared up and he is very active if I put him in a carrier. Inside the waterlandtub, he does not move.

I have been injecting him every three days and I wonder if this is part of the problem,i.e. he is hiding from me because he does not want to get a needle poke. I have put in acidic water (6.2 PH) and am taking them out for direct sun every day. He remains in the exact spot where I left him.

The vet told me last week to bring him back in if he does not start to eat and she will force feed him. Thoughts?