Reptile & Amphibian Forums

As I posted in response to Bonnie's "Armata behaviour", This morning I put in some fresh sphagnum moss behind the water pan when I noticed the largest female trying to squeese herself between that and the back wall of the viv. Next thing I knew she was in the middle of the moss while I was misting it. She hung her head over the side of the water pan and started lapping up the spray that was running down her snout.

By the time I left both females were on that fresh moss so I removed the male and non-gravid female to the other armata viv for the time being. I figured something had to give soon as the big girl is starting to spook me. I was really hoping today would be the day.

When I got home this evening she was in the water pan but not like normal. She was standing up high up on her back legs, sort of like she was straining. Later when I checked she was laying in the water with her back legs streched out behind her and her frong legs and head up on the side of the pan. I am using a plastic shoebox for the water right now as she seems to be liking the soaks lately.

Anyway, when the lights went off I went in and checked one last time to see how the girls were doing and both are back up in their roosting spots. However, there is now a normal looking egg that was deposited in the water pan. I candled and it is normal looking, well calcified, and has a fetal disc. I am guessing she was having problems passing it for some reason and needed the soak to get it going.
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Marcia - FroggieB Dragons
www.froggieb.com/MHDHome.html

Didn't mean to hit enter yet, now what I am wondering is if this should get her going so that she will be able to lay the rest of the clutch on her own now. Anyone ever experience anything like this? Like I said, the egg didn't even look all that large! Well, I just measured and maybe it is pretty large. It is just under an inch long, and almost 1/2 inch wide. I couldn't find my little ruler to measure centimeters. I would have to say about 2.29 centimeters long and 1.22 centimeters wide.

Anyway, I sure hope this one cleared the way and she deposits the rest tomorrow!
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Marcia - FroggieB Dragons
www.froggieb.com/MHDHome.html

That’s the size of a normal egg!

Theirs only one reason and one reason only for a female to drop in water!
She’s dehydrated.

Well hydrated females can nest in dry leaf litter, if the air is well saturated.

This happens to me with new imports, I simply put my bottle close to the mouth and spray until she wants no more, 2-3 times a day if necessary.

Regardless of what peoples tell you or what you read, hydration is your immediate problem.
rgds

Who do you think has the most chances of being dehydrated, kids playing all day in the rain, or kinds playing all day in the sun?
Of course playing in the sun make you thirsty, so you will drink. Playing in the rain tricks your brain into a false sense of hydration, you feel the thrust when you are already in dehydration. I explained this months ago.

If hydration does not help, I would consider a calcium and an ocytocin shot within the next two days before she is too weak, to manage it even with that kind of help.

I keep my fingers crossed

Ingo

Ingo

I am impress! You have more then 4000 posts on your favourite forum, I tried to read 100 or so then realised I cant understand a word.

However no dough about your contribution to this hobby, bravo!

As you already know I am interested in your experience, even though we have different views on herpetoculture, I feel I can learn a lot from you, and vice versa.

I have a down to earth and simple approach to herpetoculture based on animal behaviour and experimentation.

You on the other hand seem to rely on science and literature, you have a very commercialised husbandry practise, you believe in the virtues of the latest products and rely on science to cure diseases of husbandry.

This is all fine, but when you say things like your present post, I don’t quit understand what brings you to this conclusion?

I have no problems with the use of oxitocine, iv use it 100s of times in the past, however I know these hormones injections are now obsolete, at least with my animals as I can easily make my lizards produce them.

But it’s the calcium injections I don’t really understand the need, at this pint in time the eggs are already shelled, they no more have a need for calcium.

Injecting calcium now can only contribute to a multitude of potential organ damage, as the organism will try to evacuate what the body doesn’t need.

Most will end up in faeces, this especially if calcium is injected but when its injected it must enter the blood stream, cardiovascular and renal system, clogging and leading to poor blood circulation.

This is why I don’t really understand this practise, and even in cases before the eggs are shelled, calcium injections is pretty useless as the metabolism can only handle small daily doses, for such injections to be effectively processed, they would need to be broken down in 100 doses and injected every day until the female nest.

This is why simply dusting insects already supplies more then the daily needed calcium dose.

Pleas tell me if I am missing something here?

Rgds

I have always wondered what the calcium is for myself. I understand the hormones, we used those for our rabbits back when I was breeding them but the calcium escapes my understanding.
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Marcia - FroggieB Dragons
www.froggieb.com/MHDHome.html

Hello,
Though I have never had need to use a calcium shot for any of my animals, I have heard of many other people using them. The point is, even once the eggs are shelled, to replenish the calcium "borrowed" from the animal's bones for the calcification process. This is becuase the bones are somewhat weakened by this process as a result of the calcium being taken away from them for the egg making process. Though this is important, I too have found simply dusting the food items given to the female lizard to be a satisfactory way of supplying her with replacement calcium. Good discussion topic.

Regards, EMWhite

Marcia can you share with me, how your female nested?

Temps, dept, condition of media, I will keep this data on file, it may eventually help us better understand them later on?

A note on the larger eggs, often the develop like any other egg, however babies from them hatch with a solid yolk reserve when the siblings have none left. Also these eggs can remain submerged 14 days without any ill effect, this is why I suspected about possible flooding in nature.