Reptile & Amphibian Forums

It looks to me like the animal is not ematiated. The pictures are a little blurry, and as both Mark and Fireside have itimated it is the season for hibernation. It looks to me like he could just be put down for at least a month or so, at the most bring him up at March 1st. The animal should have the light turned off and he should burry himself, you can check on him from time to time. YOu might consider dampening one side of the cage slightly, not wet but just damp, as somethinmes they are drawn to a damp soil, leave the otherside dry, let him choose.
With respect to the temps in the cage and your lighting, the hot side should be about 105 and the cool about 85 and the ambient temp should be around 85 to 90 degrees. THe fact is in the desert a 100 degree temp can have ground temps up to 130 or 140 degrees, while they will cross through these gradients most of the time they stay convientently under a bush or burrow under the soil to keep cool. So the temps should go up in my opinion when ever you do take him out of hibernation, and as stated the samll crickets are most attainable at any time, so I would go with those for feeding. ALso you need to consider ordering ants on the internet, our site gives you the link or find some in your local area, these need to be the big red ants, not grease ants or fire ants - another thing that works well is termites if you can find those as well. Small mini-mealworms, wax worms, and small crickets and an occasional moth caught around the porch light is also relished. YOu can use a small hand held battery powered vaccum to suck up ants but at this moment in time they are probably not avialable because they also hibernate during the winter as well. BUt from what I see it looks as though you could hibernate---
I call on the others to give their opinions about this, but I think I would be comfortable in hibernating him from his looks and just check on him every couple weeks, if the legs get real skinny or the fat around his hips show his bones or he seems lethergic then certianly warm him up and feed him. BUt it is normal for these lizards to slow down at this time of the year. I don't know what kind of lighting your using but I would recommend you either use a 7% or higher UVB flourescent, or a 10.0 flourescent ($19.00 through LLL Reptiles) and also use the zoomed basking bulb. He needs to be in a 20 Gal. Long cage, you could use something smaller but normall we recommend a 40 gal for a pair. While he is heated up you may try and spray in the cage on a rock or window and see if he will lap up some water please follow Firesides recommendations on that. I hope this helps, please feel free to ask anything else, it would be great if we could get one more nice clear picture of the animal, preferably as you did before from the top looking down. Judging the animals condition without a clear picture may be difficult but I do think he looks good enough to hibernate for some time anyway...........Cheers!!!
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Phrynosoma.org

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signature file edited. [phw 11/14/04]

Here are some better pics.

2

He looks healthy. He's probably trying to hibernate. Repto gave good advice on that.

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www.phrynosoma.com

I agree with the assessment that it is apparently of healthy weight. It probably could be hibernated safely if that were the only condition. However, I hesitate in light of the lizard's youth, and your inexperience, to advise it. Though we could help you with setting it up for hibernation, I question whether it may be better to keep it up at this point. This is a judgement call. For people new to HL's with a wild adult in good health, I recommend they let them go ahead and hibernate. For young one's, I advocate it might be better to keep them up and growing. There is insufficient history on this one since being removed from the wild, but we know it was kept by a child and may not have eaten or drank sufficiently in 2 weeks or so. Since conditions to survive hibernation would be more critical for a juvenile horned lizard, I put that out for consideration. It is not an adult yet. Nor is it quite a baby. Therefore a good case could be made either way.

Or as a compromise, keep it active, fed the right things, and hydrated, with proper lighting for at least a few more weeks. Then we can go from there on an abbreviated hibernation later. You need some time to make preparations for hibernation anyway, and a period of observation would be recommended.

Take caution with capturing insects as food, especially if you use pesticides around your home, or live in a neigborhood, or near agricultural areas. Flying insects are more safe to catch around the home. For ground crawlers I recommend going out of your way to undeveloped areas to make sure they are safe. Harvester ants are the best thing to use, and their natural majority prey in the wild. Myself and Cable sell ants normally, but not so much right now, as Repto said, they hibernate too. I'm afraid the best recommendation to get these ants reliably for now is through antsalive.com until the spring. They are more pricey and it might take a couple weeks to get them, so be prepared.
I don't recommend mealworms, or anything like that at this time. They are not very nutritious, and can be dangerous to use if you don't have all the information. I recommend ants primarily, crickets ( the smallest you can get ) occasionally or as a backup, and a moth as you can catch them, as Repto said. Whatever you feed to it, when it comes to something other than ants, make sure it is small.

20 gallon >or bigger< aquarium for sure. As it grows to adult it will really need a 40gal. anyway, so you might consider that now if you are going to keep it, and start buying setup equipment.

The only thing I disagree with Reptoman about is the choice of UVB lighting. I advocate a mercury vapor UVB spot/flood lamp over a flourescent tube light to provide the REQUIRED UVB lighting. I find flourescent tubes to be cheaper, but inferior unless you are going to buy several of them. Good mercury vapors can be found online, including ebay sometimes, for better than pet store prices. Just stay away from SunSeeker's commonly sold on ebay. I recommend MegaRay at the top of the reptile hobbyist line ( $50 ), or ZooMed PowerSun ( $30 ) as a cheaper, less effective, but acceptable alternative.

You will soon start discovering what will be involved in the care of a horned lizard, and I know it's pretty soon, but have you decided whether to keep it, or no?
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"A man that should call everything by it's right name, would hardly pass the streets without being knocked down as a common enemy." The Complete Works of George Savile, First Marquess of Halifax 1912,246

WITH RESPECT TO THE ADVICE THAT FIRESIDE GAVE, i WOULD CONCUR ALSO THAT BECAUSE THIS IS A YOUNG ANIMAL IT COULD GO EITHER WAY.
yOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO GET SMALL CRICKETS FROM YOUR LOCAL PET SHOP. wITH RESPECT TO MEALWORMS fIRESIDE IS RIGHT, HOWEVER THERE ARE MINI MEALWORMS WHICH ARE NOT MEALWORMS AND FINE FOR YOUR HOENDED LIZARD, i ALWAYS PREFER TO FEED FRESHLY MOLTED MEALWORMS. HOWEVER BECAUSE OF THE CONFUSION HERE i WOULD FOLLOW fIRESIDES ADVICE SO THERE ISN'T A MISTAKE MADE ABOUT MEALWORMS GIVEN OTHER INSECTS AVAIABLE. iF YOU SHOULD DECIDE TO KEEP HIM UP THEM MAKE SURE YOUR TEMPS ARE UP AS RECOMMENDED. i THINK IF YOU ARE ATTENTIVE THE ANIMAL SHOULD DO WELL. i HAVE FOUND THAT SMALL WAX WORMS MAKE A GOOD MEAL AS WELL M THEY ARE SOFT HAVE SOME FAT IN THEM AND MOISTURE.

oNE THINK i SEE COMING FROM BOTH OF OUR ADVICE HAS TO DO WITH HYDRATION, i WOULD IN SOMEWHAY SPARY THE ROCKS OR PLANTS IN THE CAGE AND SEE IF HE WILL DRINK, BUT THIS ALSO MEANS HE NEEDS TO BE HEATED UP SO HE'S ACTIVE. sO EHAT EVER CHIOCE YOU MAKE i WOULD WANT TO MAKE SURE HE'S TAKEN A DRINK.
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Phrynosoma.org

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signature file edited. [phw 11/14/04]