Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I just spend a full week trying to understand why you guys lost some perfectly healthy gravid females.
I know you think they died from egg binding, however I don’t think this is the case.
Retention serve a purpose, lizards have the ability to hold onto eggs until nesting conditions are right, though I wasn’t able to determined how long they can retain eggs without any illefects, I was able to certify from past experience that one month seems reasonable for any female, I also know wild lizards also retain when conditions requires them to do so.

Though I was able to make this female retain a full week after she started digging, I felt this experiment was unnecessary, this female is nesting today simply because I provided her with good nesting options. She spent the week with no options and poor temps.

My conclusion is that lizards must be provided with a choice of temps, hydration, nesting materials, I mean not only one choice but many choice of each, if they are not provided with choices they will retain, it’s this simple.

Don’t waste your time on things that aren’t relevant to nesting, good options are all your lizards need to nest properly. I read many articles from supposedly competent sources on the net, and none seem to match my understanding, in fact I wouldn’t waste time and animals on them.

My opinion on why your lizards died, they starved.
Advanced females (especially past due time) don’t move as much for hunting and drinking, the eggs they are carrying are energy demanding, even if she doesn’t move she’s burning energy like hell, reptiles have the ability to produce some internal heat, this protects the embryos from low temps and keeps the females metabolism higher then normal, at this time females need more of little quality foods then normally, otherwise she will get the needed proteins from her very own body.
This simple down to earth approach was no mentioned anywhere, seems like science miss out on simple things.

Anyway the facts are that your lizards missed on the above and consequently failed, I see no need to search any farther.

15 nataliae eggs

Congratulations! Hope they all produce!
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Marcia - FroggieB Dragons
www.froggieb.com/MHDHome.html

After my armata died I took the eggs out. They were not stuck together as I saw in one lizard almost 2 years ago. They slid right out. I assumed she just wasn't laying them. I did try different temps and nesting material also. The eggs were not fertile and a couple of them were turning green on the end. I guess they were begining to rot or she had an infection. I did not find any evidence of a broken egg.

This is another post I will keep for future reference. Thank you.
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BONNIE

Just about every lizard anywhere in the world understand sand, this is why I mix it with sphagnum, the top layer is only sphagnum. From hear I can add a little potting soil or decaying oak leafs and see how they progress, temperature is easy a simple basking direct on the floor, will allow for a gradient, my basking is about 130f. hydration is also easy as you simply add water to keep the hydrometer above 80% for a nesting cage, the substrate will take care of itself. FOOD and WATER is vital especially in such an energy demanding period.
Other then this only stress can stop a lizard from nesting, handling stress or cage mate stress.

Ryan
Bugs! In the substrate are excellent, not only do they brake it down, but they signal a female this is a viable environment for her babies, they understand support, there nature is all about survival, they may not care about the last plastic plant you got from home depot, but they sure care about food for there offspring’s.

I control bug population buy sinking a small bowl in witch the bugs fall inn, or I place a board flat on the ground under witch I sprayed water, then vacuum the insects the next day, usually there’s 100s if not 1000s. Also glue traps works well if placed strategically, once in a while I kill all bugs with a strip of vapona, I do this only if I see sand mites affecting my lizards. Peat moss is one of the worst substrate, avoid it at all cost.

You say that these females were starving themselves to death yet the large female I lost was eating up to the last few days before death. She had nice layers of fat in her abdomin, not excessive but nontheless, fat. None of the others had these fat layers so I don't believe that she starved. However here eggs were starting to stick together with a thick white substance between some of them. I also like to point out that there were different areas in the 6 foot long viv with different substrates, varied moisture contents, and definitly different temperatures. I just don't see how they could not have found a suitable nesting site.

Also, what is your problem with peat moss? I mix Spaghnum peat with my coir and find that it holds the moisture a bit better. I have done this for 8 years and never had problems with it with any of my capra-likes.
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Marcia - FroggieB Dragons
www.froggieb.com/MHDHome.html

Good then you know your problem is stress related, being with cage mate or in visual contact with something disturbing? In any case it can be prevented.

The problem I have with peat moss is that it stick to hempen or hemi clitoris when the lizards defecate, this sometimes leads to septicaemia and prolaps, in general it sticks all over lizards, and when dry is inhaled.

I lost a few valuable lizards to peat moss in the past.

Oh the white substance is an antibacterial mucus that protects the eggs and lubricate the delivery membrane, its normal that it glues everything after the female died. This substance keeps the female safe from infection long after the eggs go bad, in fact some female lizards can drop bad hardened eggs months after due time, these are known as slugs or products of retention, fairly common in large collections.
I dough these have anything to do with your females death, however the antibacterial properties of the reproductive system in reptiles are negatively affected by most drugs, even after a long time, this is why I refuse to obtain reptiles that where treated in anyway, its actually the very first thing I ask the dealer before obtaining animals. Remember last year when I refused a shipment of rare lizards because the importer treated them? Well none of these lizards are still alive today, even though some went to very experienced keepers.

One of those keepers is my long time friend, for decades we meat at the dealer when new animals arrive, I pick some and he picks some, few months down I get eggs he gets none, though I keep telling him to stop treating new reptiles, he insists on safety quarantine for his collection, I gave up on advising him many years ago, yet I still hatch eggs and he’s still unsuccessful with most of his collections. He blames the animals, how silly!