Reptile & Amphibian Forums

question.. my substrate is going to a Zilla's fir and sphagnum peat mixture..can those plants hold up in that sort of soil...will they thrive? Should i add something to it to provide nutrients?

I'm not certain about the Zilla's fir, which is chopped up Douglas fir. Isn't this meant for dry reptile bedding? I'm not certain how the plants will grow in it, or whether it may contain some turpenoids, which will discourage most plant growth and perhaps not be good for the frogs, as unlike reptiles, they have a permeable skin membrane in place of a thick skin. I personally avoid conifer based substrates because they may contain turpenoids, and stick to the organic composts, cocoanut fiber, and the long light brown long sphagnum (Canadian or New Zealand) rather than the fine, dark, garden type peat. I don't care for the latter because it can tend to get pretty soggy rather than remain relatively loose. Other people do use it though, so perhaps it's just my predjudice. The long brown sphagnum has some kind of antimicrobial quality that prevents stem and root rot.

But other than that, those plants will do all right in just about anything without additional nutrients for a long time. As the soil gradually breaks down, more nitrogen will become available to the plants, especially after the frogs are added. If they show signs of deficiencies, you could perhaps use a very highly diluted organic fish or seaweed emulsion and spray it over the leaves, only slightly wetting the soil with it. This may give a boost to the organic process to help the substrate begin to break down and release its own nutrients. But don't boost it too much, and don't do it unless the plants actually show signs of deficiency.

At first, substrates such as cocoanut fiber and shredded woods take up a lot of available nitrogen to begin the process of breaking down. Even then, cocoanut does it very slowly, while the organic composts have already begun the process in the compost pile. With most suitable vivarium plants such as those you purchased, this doesn't affect them much. Tropical soils are thin and lean and most of these kinds of plants get their nourishment from very little detritus and absorb some from the humid air.

Growing them as potted house plants is somewhat different, as the air is usually drier. However, you may notice that plants such as some philodendron, pothos, etc. can grow in straight water in a jar for months without signs of fatal deficiencies.

Here's a photo of a Kohleria cutting I put in a vivarium three months ago as a small piece with two leaves. The substrate here is organic compost, cocoanut fiber and long brown sphagnum. In fact all of these plant were unrooted cuttings when introduced.

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Patty
Pahsimeroi, Idaho

Dendrobates: auratus blue, auratus Ancon Hill, tinctorius azureus, leucomelas. Phyllobates: vittatus, terribilis, lugubris. Epipedobates: anthonyi tricolor pasaje. Ranitomeya fantastica, imitator, reticulata. Adelphobates castaneoticus, galactonotus. Oophagia pumilio Bastimentos. (updated systematic nomenclature)

oh I see.. My frogs are doing fine.. but I noticed my plants arent doing as well as i had hoped...what if I mixed peat moss with shredded oak leaves with organic soil? Would that work? With a top layer of the moss that I posted?

That would work. Is everything already in with the fir and peat? If so, I would guess that it's perhaps the fir that is the problem with your plants, but I'm not sure. You could top dress with the combination you propose, but put the leaf litter on top instead of mixing it into the soil without breaking it up.
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Patty
Pahsimeroi, Idaho

Dendrobates: auratus blue, auratus Ancon Hill, tinctorius azureus, leucomelas. Phyllobates: vittatus, terribilis, lugubris. Epipedobates: anthonyi tricolor pasaje. Ranitomeya fantastica, imitator, reticulata. Adelphobates castaneoticus, galactonotus. Oophagia pumilio Bastimentos. (updated systematic nomenclature)