Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I looked at my young female Spotted today and a few of her nails are broken off on her fore-claws. I'm not sure exactly when it happened, but I know they weren't like that until very recently. She was housed with my young male (~3.5" CL) all of yesterday and overnight. I'm wondering if he may have broken them. I have not noticed him pursuing her, but perhaps it happened when I wasn't around???

I also had a pair of crayfish in her tank that had grown fairly large. They can be aggressive over food, so I wonder if they could have done it. At any rate, the crayfish have been removed and the male is back in a separate enclosure. Anyone else experienced broken nails before? How long did they take to heal and regrow? She seems fine, but it isn't pretty. Some are broken off pretty close to the base (I wonder if she might lose them?).

Any thoughts?

I'm stumped on this 1 Emy. If they are completely gone,I'm pretty sure they dont grow back.As for my eggs.Yup no good.Shrivled up.Pretty bummed but theres always the next batch to look forward to.

They aren't completely gone, but some are pretty close. I think most or all should grow back, but I wish I knew how it happened so that I can make sure it doesn't happen again. it looks pretty painful.

If they had fallen out then I would suspect an infection or diet deficiency, but they appear to be broken off. If she didn't get such a varied diet I might still suspect a dietary deficiency making them brittle, but she does have a diverse diet including Reptomin. Maybe she was reared up too rapidly prior to my getting her and the tissue isn't very dense, thus prone to breakage?

Jeez that does look painful!I'ld say they will grow back,but how did they get like that is a good question.I would say your other turtle would have caused some skin damage if a bite was the cause.Almost looks like he was clawing to get somthing for awhile to maybe wear them down.I'ld post those pics on ATP,There has to be someone that has seen this before or maybe knows.I'ld say no way diet would do that too,if that was the case it would probally all fall off.Very weird Emy

It looks like your spotty has a fungal infection on her forelimbs. This will often cause the animal to either lose the nail entirely or have it break off as seen in the picture. Try different remedies for fighting the fungal infection including cleaning the affected area with a dilute betadine solution and dry-docking, using tea to increase the acidity of the water, making sure the turtles are recieving adequate UVB exposure, and having a dry and proper basking spot. I have even found an addition of 1-2 gallons of local pond, swamp, or marsh water to an enclosure will quickly clear up an infection! If these turtles are indoors make sure your UV fluorescent bulb is at the right distance depending on strength. (8-10 inches for Reptisun 5.0 or 12-18 inches for Reptisun 10.0 for example.) Also, make sure the UVB is not obstructed by plastic or glass. Screen is ok, but for proper utilization of the light, the rays should not be obstructed or filtered. Try dry-docking outdoors under natural sunlight for a short time each day. When outdoor dry-docking I would recommend a fenced in enclosure where the turtle can choose between sun and shaded areas, or a supervised period in the sun. As far as basking goes, if you use cork or wood basking sites, I have found these substrates easily promote fungal or bacterial infections, and I personally try not to use either. Try a different type of basking site if this is the case. As for my last thought, I would remove any other turtle or other inhabitant such as the crayfish from the tank. Another turtle can easily take advantage of the afflicted turtle's situation because it is easily aggressive or just plain bored. Also, try researching other remedies for the afflicted skin and see which works best. Good luck!

I would guess that the male bit off the nails. My Wood turtles do this often to each other.

Also, I agree with JGsav. The "blue-ish" color to your turtle's skin is not normal. I just have a couple of things to add to JG's great post. Make certain that the basking spot is hot. With the massive push towards UV, people are forgetting that one of the major functions of a basking spot is for the turtle to heat up. A nice, hot basking spot will help the skin to dry out and boost the animal's immune system, all helping to fight off skin and shell infections. A small site approaching 90 is appropriate for a spotted. Fluorescent bulbs cannot produce the needed heat.

Spotted turtles thrive in acidic water. The addition of blackwater extract directly into the water, or the placement of special peat packets into your filter will create naturally tannic water that should help your turtles fight off infection.

Hope this helps. Good luck.

On the topic of keeping the water acidic, it's far more easy, i've found, to just keep a few pieces of driftwood in the tank. Besides my turtles loving to climb and bask on them, driftwood slowly leaches away, lowering the pH and acidity of the water.

I very much appreciate all the advise. I also checked ATP to see what folks had posted on the topic. She broke off one more nail a few days ago and had not been housed with the male Spotted or the large crayfish since I originally noticed the breakage. This time I actually saw the nail broken/hanging before it fell off. I'm thinking JGsav is on to something with the fungus. It sounds logical to me and at the very least it can't be helping things.

I did notice the blueish tint to her skin and figured she might have some mild fungus. She has been basking quite a bit the last few days and it has improved... but then she seems to go back to her more aquatic habits and the condition worsens again (this has been going on for a few weeks). There is a land portion in the enclosure, but she doesn't really use it yet. I've been taking both her and her mate outside in a plastic tub (separately now) for the last couple months. I usually keep a little water in the tub and it is half covered with moist long-fiber live sphagnum, to help buffer them from potentially overheating. I am planning now to get a second plastic tub that I will use strictly for dry-docking. I will also pick up some Betadine to swab her with prior to dry-docking.

I DO have lots of driftwood in both of their enclosures which could be harboring excessive fungal populations. I've ordered some additional filtration equipment to try and improve water quality. I also try to bake (YES, in the oven) the driftwood occasionally to keep it "cleaner." Incidentally, the crayfish (small ones now) like to scrape it clean (fun to watch).

Ken, I have played with a couple methods for lowering pH including adding Pin Oak acorns to the tank and soaking a sphagnum filled sock in the replacement water, but I think I might give the Blackwater Extract product a try. What would be a good level for keeping pathogens in check (i.e. How low should I go?)?

I have lots of live plants (Duckweed, Coontail, Bladderwort) to help absorb nutrients and provide a potential snack. I would be a bit concerned about adding pond water... for fear of introducing more harmful microbes than beneficial ones, but perhaps its worth a try. I'm sure some of both are introduced with the vegetation anyway.

I just checked the temp of her basking spot (spotlight bulb) and its at ~94.5F at its closest location (she has the option of being further away). She doesn't usually bask there though. The UVB bulbs could probably stand to be a couple inches closer, but they've both been getting outside time. I'll be more concerned come fall/winter time (in Ohio).

I suppose I could go with a completely sterile environment? No driftwood, no substrate, feeding outside the tank, etc... but for me that partially defeats the purpose of keeping turtles and would seem to diminish their quality of life.

I'll keep you posted... and I'm always open to further suggestions! Thanks again.

I wouldn't worry about the addition of pond water as far as adding in harmful microbes. If it came from a pond or marsh, etc. that is in good health the biological processes should be in check. Personally, I seed all of my environments with beneficial bacteria in this manner and have never had a problem. In fact it usually (and very quickly) takes care of problems you may be having with the tank. Whatever you do, do not make a more sterile environment. This will help your problems in the very short term but will lead to consistent long term problems. Your cage sounds pretty good with the addition of basking spots,live plants, etc. Also, it is my opinion that in a tank environment gravel, etc. substrate is a necessity for providing biological filtration. All the surface area of those rocks provide area for your beneficial bacteria to grow. In addition, you will notice that gravel acts as a sediment trap. This is most noticed when you do a tank clean. This sediment trap is ok if you let the tank naturally cycle itself out. The beneficials on the substrate surfaces will actually be naturally breaking down the trapped sediment. Just make sure you keep up with your water quality (ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate). Do more frequent small (10-15% water changes) than less frequent, larger water changes. The more aquatic plants, the better. You also want to rarely change or clean out your filter cartridges except when they are in desperate need, as in no water is getting through. In this case rinse off the cartridges only, and do not clean the rest of the tank. This will help the biological filtration mend itself as quickly as possible. If you do a tank clean and filter clean you will need weeks to regain the process. And whatever you do, don't bleach or clean anything with hot water, you need to save as much of those beneficials as possible. Your frequent trips outside with the turts are a great idea. I would also try Ken's recommendation to increase the acidity of the water. Good luck.

Ditto.

I use driftwood to naturally lower ph in my outdoor enclosures. With driftwood, you have to make certain to pick well aged pieces. Also,they release tannins very slowly and work most effectively when the water is left to stand for long periods...like months. I've never heard warnings such as those stated by JG. However, his reputation preceeds him and I will now be looking into it!

I use two main methods for adding tannins to the water. I'm not so concerned about pH. I honestly don't even measure it. This is not very scientific, but I try to aim for a water color that looks like weak sweet tea (yes, I'm in the South). I'll try to measure it for you. I'm curious also. Anyway, I fill pillow cases with milled peat from Lowes and let them sit in rain barrels full of water for about a week. These are for the outdoor enclosures. For the indoor enclosures, I have found it much easier just to add one mL of blackwater extract (I use Tetra) to one gallon of water and sit it for 24 hours to let the Cl evaporate.

My past experiences (and my friends') with spotted turtles has led me to one very strong conclusion...they do absolutely the best when kept outdoors in artificially created bogs. They certainly can thrive indoors, but it takes much more work, and problems often arise. Spotteds are very cold tolerant, and would have no problems (unless they were freshly plucked from a North Fl bog) wintering in Ohio.