Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hi All,
I've recently acquired an awesome little Manokwari type that had no issues at all up until two days ago. It began to shed but the skin broke off behind its head and it seemingly cant get the rest off no matter how hard he's trying. The Heat/Humidity are exactly as they should be and I've gone so far as to place a piece of somewhat abrasive cage furniture to assist (just in case). I have a friend who recently had a rainbow neo go into shed and never come out...so yes, paranoia is starting to set in. Mind you, this is not my first snake by any means, but this IS my first GTP.

Any suggestions on next steps? I want to make sure that I'm adequately prepared to act if need be.
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Thanks!!!!!
John

1.1 '04 Albino BCI
1.0 '05 Albino BCI 100% Het Stripe
1.0 '06 Anery BCI
0.1 '04 Anery BCI 100% het Snow/ 50% Het stripe
1.0 '05 Ghost BCI
1.0 '02 Normal BCI
0.1 '06 Normal BCI Circleback
0.1 '04 Normal BCI 66% Het Snow
0.1 '06 Sunkist BCI
1.0 '05 Brazilian Rainbow Boa
0.0.1 '05 Snow Corn

Hmmm, I'm thinking if the temps and humidity were just where they should be you wouldn't have had a shed problem.

Is the cage oversized for the snake? It's very hard to keep a large cage at right temps and humidity throughout for a small neo. Does it have a screen top? If there's too much ventilation you could be losing a lot of humidity out the top.

Yeah I thought that too, yet here we are...The more I think about it, perhaps the hygrometer is no good, and throwing bad readings, because the humidity levels in the cage are 85-90%, according to the hygrometer, but once again - here we are.

The cage is actually a Barrs 12x12x16. Technically its a screentop right out of the box, i've modified it so that's no longer an issue of humidity being lost through the top, its sealed up tight as a drum.

Thanks for your reply
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Thanks!!!!!
John

BCI/BCC
0.1 '04 Albino
0.1 '04 Anery 100% Het Snow/ 50% Het Stripe
0.1 '05 Salmon (probable super)
0.1 '07 Suriname
1.0 '02 Normal Redtail
1.0 '04 Albino '05 Ghost (probable super)
1.0 '05 Anery 100% Het Snow
1.0 '07 EBV Pastel Salmon

ECC:
0.1 '08 Normal ECC

GTP:
0.0.1 '08 Manokwari Type

Colubrids:
0.0.1 Snow Corn

BP:
1.0 '05 66% PH Pied

I had my one biak/png who had difficult sheds the first two times. Setup was identical to the others, but her shed wouldn't come off unless I manually removed it or soaked her overnight in a tub. I ended up really spraying the crap out of the cage and soaking the substrate just before shed, and the next one was fine. After that...no issues. It might be that your snake either just doesn't drink enough water and take in enough fluids prior to shed, or they just have a different shed mechanism. You may need to really soak the cage next time to see what happens. Once she gets going, it might improve. FWIW: I also changed out the excessively wet substrate after shed.
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3.2~Cornsnakes
3.4.2~Green tree python
3.3.1~ATB
1.1~Sibon Nebulatus
Dogs, cats, horses....
www.franclycac.com

John,
You have found what I believe to be the most common reason for people thinking they have lower or higher cage humidity than they really do. Low cost hygrometers are notoriously inaccurate and many can easily be off by 10% to 25% depending on the brand. Unless you are willing to spend 150 to 200 dollars for a NIST traceable with a certificate, you can never be sure if your hygrometer is reading accurately. However, you can test your own quite easily to see if it is reading properly, and here is the procedure:

1. Place a teaspoon of salt in a bottle cap or small cup and dampen it with a few drops of water (without dissolving it) to make it the consistency of wet sand.

2. Carefully place the wet salt and the hygrometer, or its probe if that type, inside a see-through container and close tightly. Don't allow any of the salt to directly contact the hygrometer. Tupperware type is best, but you can use a zip lock bag provided it seals good and you leave as much air as possible inside as well, or other type of plastic food storage container as long as it seals airtight. It may be better with the probe types to place the entire unit, probe and all, within the container so as to insure that everything is air tight.

3. Let it sit for at least 8 hours at room temperature and note the reading on the hygrometer without opening the container. It should read 75%, and the difference is how much your hygrometer is off.

4. If it does have an adjustment screw or other adjustment device, adjust to 75%, through a small hole made in the bag if necessary.

The relative humidity equalibrium in the interior air produced by the saturated salt produces the accuracy. I have an expensive certified dial hygrometer I purchased many years ago and have checked it periodically using this method, and it shows to be a very accurate way to check hygrometers as when done correctly, the humidity within the container or bag is always within a percent or two of 75%.

Kelly

>>John,
>>You have found what I believe to be the most common reason for people thinking they have lower or higher cage humidity than they really do. Low cost hygrometers are notoriously inaccurate and many can easily be off by 10% to 25% depending on the brand. Unless you are willing to spend 150 to 200 dollars for a NIST traceable with a certificate, you can never be sure if your hygrometer is reading accurately. However, you can test your own quite easily to see if it is reading properly, and here is the procedure:
>>
>>1. Place a teaspoon of salt in a bottle cap or small cup and dampen it with a few drops of water (without dissolving it) to make it the consistency of wet sand.
>>
>>2. Carefully place the wet salt and the hygrometer, or its probe if that type, inside a see-through container and close tightly. Don't allow any of the salt to directly contact the hygrometer. Tupperware type is best, but you can use a zip lock bag provided it seals good and you leave as much air as possible inside as well, or other type of plastic food storage container as long as it seals airtight. It may be better with the probe types to place the entire unit, probe and all, within the container so as to insure that everything is air tight.
>>
>>3. Let it sit for at least 8 hours at room temperature and note the reading on the hygrometer without opening the container. It should read 75%, and the difference is how much your hygrometer is off.
>>
>>4. If it does have an adjustment screw or other adjustment device, adjust to 75%, through a small hole made in the bag if necessary.
>>
>>The relative humidity equalibrium in the interior air produced by the saturated salt produces the accuracy. I have an expensive certified dial hygrometer I purchased many years ago and have checked it periodically using this method, and it shows to be a very accurate way to check hygrometers as when done correctly, the humidity within the container or bag is always within a percent or two of 75%.
>>
>>Kelly

Kelly,

That is some of the best advice I have heard all week!!! Thanks for the tip!.
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Jason A.
"Long time Herper, first year Breeder `07."

the nice I like about it is the procedure checks the hygrometer close to a pretty standard humidity point for tropical herps.

Kelly

I'd like to thank everyone for the replies, and not beating me up for the minor "freak out" sorry - my brain froze up on me.

After a good overnight soak with some rocks in the sterilite container (thanks to Troy Frantz for the tip)the little bugger is all good and glowing yellow again.

Turns out that the hygrometer was shot. I picked up 3 over the weekend and compared the average to the one that I had...it was approx 20% off on the low side. That is, assuming that the ones that I picked up are accurate LOL.

Kelly - thanks for the tip on adjusting the hygrometers, definitely going to give that a try.
-----
Thanks!!!!!
John

BCI/BCC
0.1 '04 Albino
0.1 '04 Anery 100% Het Snow/ 50% Het Stripe
0.1 '05 Salmon (probable super)
0.1 '07 Suriname
1.0 '02 Normal Redtail
1.0 '04 Albino '05 Ghost (probable super)
1.0 '05 Anery 100% Het Snow
1.0 '07 EBV Pastel Salmon

ECC:
0.1 '08 Normal ECC

GTP:
0.0.1 '08 Manokwari Type

Colubrids:
0.0.1 Snow Corn

BP:
1.0 '05 66% PH Pied