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Steve - spurs on juvenile greens.....

Kelly_Haller Apr 09, 2009 06:24 PM

I wanted to answer the question you had asked earlier about spurs. You stated that you had a young 6 foot green that was probing as female but had 2mm spurs. Many male greens are probe sexed as females due to the morphology of male greens as opposed to most other boids. With greens, the probe must first be inserted into one side of the cloaca perpendicular to the body. Gently pass the probe about a third to a half way through the body until you feel resistance, and then rotate it parallel to the body and probe as usual. If this is not done correctly, in males, you will miss the hemipenal pocket and the green will probe as a female. Once they get over a year or two, or reach 6 feet or so, they can be easily spur sexed. I have two photos below of female and male spurs on juvenile greens that are each 7 to 8 feet in length. In the upper photo, the female spurs have already recessed into the body, and only the small cavity containing the spur can be seen in the left and right center of the photo. There is no external spur structure visible. In the lower photo, a side view shows the male spur as almost completely external, and attached to a short appendage. In this male, the spurs were of a lighter color, as they are typically darker than this. Hope this helps with your questions.

Kelly

Replies (6)

spmoberl Apr 10, 2009 12:16 PM

Thank you very much!! Excellent response! I will check my snake out again when it finishes some digestion. It had 7 live chicks this week!

Steve
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steve

danaconda Apr 10, 2009 12:17 PM

The probing technique kelly described to you works really well and is really easy.I got a clutch of 17 neonate greens and tried probing them and it was impossible, every one of them was probing female.I contacted kelly and asked him how to do it properly and he described the above technique.Wow what a difference,the first one i probed was clearly a male and the rest all probed very easily -i ended up with 9 females and 8 males.Its just amazing how easy it is to do using this technique because its almost impossible to determine their sex using the standard probing technique.Thanks again Kelly.

Dan

DJDeron Apr 10, 2009 08:46 PM

What is the average sub-caudal scale depth for male greens versus females? I tried it on one of mine (3-4 footer) that I was unsure of and it went in about 6 scales deep. Would this be a male or female? Thanks!

Kelly_Haller Apr 13, 2009 08:37 PM

That is about half way between a male and a female. I would guess that it was a male, but you should re-probe. He may have tensed up on you and caused it to probe short. Not sure your procedure, but it is ten times easier with young greens if you have someone hold while you probe. Did it probe 6 subcaudals on both sides?

Kelly

DJDeron Apr 13, 2009 09:16 PM

I thought that seemed a little deep for a female but yet shy of what a male would be. I'm going to try it again with some more help holding. I was trying to be very gentle and without help, I was only able to do one side before the snake got squirrely. That's why I figured I would ask before trying it again to know what depths to be looking for. (I hope it is a male, my other three greens are definitely girls.) By the way, I can't wait for this weather to stabilize because I'm anxiously awaiting my pair from you Kelly! Thanks! -Deron

DJDeron Apr 13, 2009 09:22 PM

Oh Yeah, I forgot to mention...I was following Kelly's description of probing anacondas above in this post. I have probed bunches and bunches of different snakes over the years, just not anacondas. They are definitely a little different. Need someone other than my wife to help hold too!

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