Reptile & Amphibian Forums

New around here but I have been reading for a while. I live in Santa Rosa, CA and have for years been longing to find a L.z.z. I have hunted a few places that looked good to me but don't have the confidence to keep at if for very long. I usually don't move any rocks, just check the cracks in outcropings, not wanting to damage habitat. I am wondering if anyone has experience finding these elusive critters, and can point me in the right direction. From reading, it seems that Zonata zonata is the least known of the subspecies? I'd really just like to find one to satisfy myself that they do exist! lol Any other herpers who have found em? Rick Staub?

Try road cruising them. It's getting to be prime time for that. As far as where...you'll have to figure that one out for yourself

road cruise? I figured that would be the most unproductive method. I thought they don't stray to far from the rock crevices? As far as prime time, do you mean they are out looking for mates? Darn, none of the places I can think of have any roads going through habitat. Is napa county or sonoma my best bet?

You need to invest some money in Brian Hubbs's book on Mountain Kings. If you wanna learn how to catch them, you would do well to immerse yourself in literature, reading all that you can about them. June is a good time to see them on the crawl. Just get yourself a good map/atlas and look for out of the way public roads in all the different counties that they're found up there in nocal.

>>road cruise? I figured that would be the most unproductive method. I thought they don't stray to far from the rock crevices? As far as prime time, do you mean they are out looking for mates? Darn, none of the places I can think of have any roads going through habitat. Is napa county or sonoma my best bet?

They hibernate in the rock crevices, but they do disperse during the summer months away from the crevices. They have to look for mates and for food. Zonata originated in Southern California, and before that, from Arizona, as its closest relative is pyromelana. So, over the course of millions of years, they have migrated over a couple thousand miles total. In fact, what we call pulchra and parvirubra actually came from Baja California quite recently in geological time scale. They could not have done that if they stayed around a few rocks.

It may also help to keep "water" in mind -- the St. Helena zonata are known to be tied to water. That's as much I can say. But I agree with Allen....doing the research and then striking it rich is the best kind of enjoyment. It will be worth it. You can find zonata zonata in a number of counties, some being much more challenging and others easier.

Napa County L.z.z.

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Jerry Kruse

And God said, "Let there be zonata subspecies for all to ponder..."

I was thinking about buying Hubbs book and likely will. I've been reading online for a few years now and it seems like no new info ever pops up as far as research and study. Does Hubbs book provide a significant level of information on L.ZZ? I've been driving, hiking, and sweating the last three days. Even though I found not so much a shed, (found some rattlers) I still love herping. Been doing it from about he age of 5. Still above all I want to find one of these snakes. Thanks guys, your comments have been motivating. I've heard through the grapevine, from a guy who knows a guy, who works up at the geysers, that they've found em. Any one tried up there? All I found were rattlers
Thanks Eric

Just ordered the Mountain Kings book.

Find a nice southwest facing creek at or above 2000 ft. Hike the canyon in the late afternoon on warm to hot days looking in the dappled sunlight areas. They should be on the move for 1-2 more weeks.

Night driving does work for coastal zonata pops but I have had better success hiking.

Persistence, Persistence, Persistence
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Rick Staub

Thanks Rick, that helps a lot! I needed to concentrate my search into more specific areas and now I know how. When you say creek, does that mean a seasonal drainage or a year round water source? None of the places I've looked contain summertime water. That could be a problem? Luckily we have google maps, I'll search around. Thanks again
Eric

The creek I found them along would be dry by July with maybe a pool or two that lasted into Aug or later on a wet year.
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Rick Staub

Rick, did you find them on public or private land? No hard feelings if you want to keep that a secret though. I got Brian Hubbs book on mountain kings and it has given me a lot of good info. Looks like I was headed in the right direction. It does mention in there of a L.ZZ found at lake sonoma at around 600ft elevation. I'm at that lake all the time and I didn't know they were out that far east. Any one ever heard of finding them out that way?

There is not much public land in that area.

I assume you meant that far west not east for where Lake Sonoma is. I would presume there are a lot more zonata east of Lake Sonoma then there are west of it.

I have never been to that lake though I have caught steelhead at the mouth of Dry Creek below it.
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Rick Staub

Yes, west is what I meant to say. Wow, really? Maybe I've seen you there and never knew it. I am a fisherman as well, I'm usually around the mouth of dry creek, come steelhead season. We had some rain here last night, wish I didn't have to work. Thought about those snakes coming out and crawling around all day. I gotta get out there