Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I have an eastern box turtle in what use to be my kids' sand box. It's 6' x 8' and made out of 2"x8"s. I don't have a top on it, but I have two beagles that run every other animal up a tree or out of the yard. For water I have modified 2 paint trays with the disposable plastic liners (so I can take them out and clean them) for the turtle to walk down in and soak if it desires (a small pond is in the works for the future). The sand that's left in there is mostly covered in crab-grass. Is there anything I need to mix or cover the sand with? What do I need to do to the enclosure for hibernation, or would it be best to make them a winter home inside? Also, I'd like to know what y'all feed your EBT's. I'm currently feeding mine strawberrys, tomatoes, carrots, grapes, romaine lettuce, and the occasional banana. I feed a veggie and a fruit over some romaine every-other day with calcium powder sprinkled over it.

Any response and other advice is greatly appreciated!

Have a blessed day,
Erich
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1.1.0. Black Rat Snakes
0.1.0. Leopard Gecko

www.erichrhom.com

I forgot to add that I'm in Shelby, NC (Southern part of the foothills) to help out with the hibernation question.
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1.1.0. Black Rat Snakes
0.1.0. Leopard Gecko

www.erichrhom.com

A couple of our EBT:


Here's her water tray:

Here's the whole pen:

Click thumbnails for a larger image.

Have a blessed day,
Erich
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1.1.0. Black Rat Snakes
0.1.0. Leopard Gecko

www.erichrhom.com

The habitat needs shade and hiding spots for the turtle. Also, you should add animal protein to it's diet. Eastern box turtles are opportunistic omnivores and it is estimated that about 50% of an adult's diet is comprised of various sources of animal protein. Worms, slugs, grubs, boiled chicken would make fine additions to the menu.

I would put some kind of cover on the box to keep your dogs out of there. An innocent little gnaw by your dogs could do some serious damage to the turtle.

Hibernating the turtle outdoors would probably be best for the turtle. It can be a real challenge to keep a turtle awake, feeding and healthy inside over the winter.

A hibernacula should have some very basic qualities: it should drain well so that your turtle doesn't drown. It should provide adequate protection from the cold so that your turtle doesn't freeze. The organic material in the hibernacula should be loose enough to allow for some air exchange. There should be room in it for your turtle to move around, up down and side to side, so that the turtle can go deeper during a cold snap, etc.

Hope that helps.

Eastern Box Turtles are largely forest dwellers. The only time they would normally be seen out in the open is during egglaying season. They may be found in coastal areas where the soil has some sand content, but for the most part they live in deciduous or mixed deciduous/coniferous forests, so the soil has a lot of organic content from all of the accumulated leaves being naturally composted. They wouldn't be found on pure sand like you have in your box. They like to dig into the substrate, so he'd be a lot happier on a soil substrate. I'd just get a load of garden/potting soil and replace the sand or at least mix equal parts sand and soil. Some short, bushy shrubs would give him some natural hiding places too.

Thanks StephF and mj3151 for the replies! What kind of bushes do y'all recommend? My parents house is surrounded by hickory and oak trees, so I may go over and get a p/u truck load of leaf litter and just cover the sand with that. How do I go about making a good place for her to hibernate? (Yea, I know I have a while, but I'm trying to plan it right the first time). The dogs have radio frequency invisible fence collars, and after I caught them eating her food for the second time today, their area has been cut back by about 3 more feet (the turtle pen is on the edge of their range) so that they can't get to her feeding area any more. I have some freeze-dried crickets that I have been sprinkling over her fruits, veggies, box turtle pellets, and calcium powder mix, and I've watched her pick off some slugs that have found their way to her pen. I also have some "fishin'" worms that I could supplement as well.

Have a blessed day,
Erich
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1.1.0. Black Rat Snakes
0.1.0. Leopard Gecko

www.erichrhom.com

You have a good start for a nice turtle pen but you should add another board so the total depth is 16 inches. And cover a third with a few boards so there will be constant shade. Skip the oak leaves and buy top soil and peat most to mix with the sand. If you wan to hibernate her outdoors you really must prepare a deep area of friable dirt, grass clippings and maple leaves for her to dig into. I would say about 2 feet in your area. I have more info on my online book at www.boxturtlesite.info

As other have noted-her diet does not have enough fresh insects. Look at the diet chapter and housing chapters, as well.

I am concerned abotu raccoons. Do you have them in your area? They will be attracted to any left over food and could make off with your turtles. I use a night time pen to protect my turtles. You can see it on Youtube, my username is boxturtlefriend.
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Tess Cook
www.boxturtlesite.info

>>You have a good start for a nice turtle pen but you should add another board so the total depth is 16 inches. And cover a third with a few boards so there will be constant shade. Skip the oak leaves and buy top soil and peat most to mix with the sand. If you wan to hibernate her outdoors you really must prepare a deep area of friable dirt, grass clippings and maple leaves for her to dig into. I would say about 2 feet in your area. I have more info on my online book at www.boxturtlesite.info
>>
>>As other have noted-her diet does not have enough fresh insects. Look at the diet chapter and housing chapters, as well.
>>
>>I am concerned abotu raccoons. Do you have them in your area? They will be attracted to any left over food and could make off with your turtles. I use a night time pen to protect my turtles. You can see it on Youtube, my username is boxturtlefriend.
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>>Tess Cook
>>www.boxturtlesite.info

My dogs hate coons, they've treed three, and run all others off. What would be the reason for the other board? (I'm not questioning your wisdom, I just want to understand). I have been adding freeze-dried crickets to her (now their) fruits and veggies, I have also been catching slugs and cicadas and feeding them to them at night. The hibernation area 2 feet deep, got it, would it be 2 feet in diameter also? Could you use other types of leaves or is there something about the maple leaves? Equal parts in that mix?

I know it's a lot of questions, and I REALLY appreciate your advice!

Have a blessed day,
Erich
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1.1.0. Black Rat Snakes
0.1.0. Leopard Gecko

www.erichrhom.com

I'm thinking ether an interesting EBT or an EBT X Three Toed hybrid. (Wild caught in SW North Carolina)
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1.1.0. Black Rat Snakes
0.1.0. Leopard Gecko

www.erichrhom.com

This is why you need another board Turtles will climb on the backs of other turtles to try and get out. They are smart! Plus if something was to fall into the pen, a turtle can use it to climb out an 8 inch high pen, but have a harder time with one that is 16 inches. If you don't want to add another board, then please add a two inch board that is angled into the pen so the turtle (s) cannot climb over the board. The leaning board will help keep them in the pen.

I worry about raccoons because you said you have the dogs' invisible fence stopping before the pen now since they eat the turtle's food. A raccoon would love to eat your turtle, and they had done so to some that I personally know of. Better safe than sorry!

It can be other types of leaves, but I wouldn't use oak leaves. It might be linked to a shell condition where a fungus attacks the shell of hibernating turtles and pits it and eats away at the seams of the scutes. Oak leaves turn the soils into just the right medium for fungal growth due to its high concentration of tannins.

Yes, the hole should be as wide as it is deep. A turtle may not dig down right in the middle and this way you are giving it most space to dig. There is a great picture of a hibernation pit made by Step Moore in my book-you might want to buy it, especially if you are thinking of getting more turtles Tess

>>I'm thinking ether an interesting EBT or an EBT X Three Toed hybrid. (Wild caught in SW North Carolina)
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>>1.1.0. Black Rat Snakes
>>0.1.0. Leopard Gecko
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>>www.erichrhom.com
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Tess Cook
www.boxturtlesite.info

"It can be other types of leaves, but I wouldn't use oak leaves. It might be linked to a shell condition where a fungus attacks the shell of hibernating turtles and pits it and eats away at the seams of the scutes. Oak leaves turn the soils into just the right medium for fungal growth due to its high concentration of tannins."

That's very interesting. Can you tell me where you came across this information? Thanks!

I'd be interested in more information on this too. I suppose it's possible, but I can't imagine it's a big problem. I've used oak leaves from a tree in my back yard (mixed with pine needles, maple leaves and others) over top of a deep layer of soil for the last six years and have never had that issue pop up. I live in the heart of T.c.carolina territory and the surrounding forests that they inhabit are thick with oak trees. I pick up (and photograph) a lot of wild turtles from the area during the warm months and have never noticed one with what looks like a shell problem caused by a fungal infection. I guess I'll start looking for evidence of this from now on.

Some of the members at Tess Cook's box turtle Yahoo Group thought that oak leaves were responsible for some shell issues.

Katrina

>>This is why you need another board Turtles will climb on the backs of other turtles to try and get out. They are smart!

Yea, I saw the new one sitting on top of one of the rocks eyeing the top of the board with bad intent.

I think I'm going to build them a different habitat though, where they are now I believe is where the water supply line comes into my house. Therefor it would be a bad idea to start to dig a hibernation pit or dig for a pond. Is there any danger of putting the pen around a butterfly bush?

Any idea of the ID of my second turtle?

Have a blessed day,
Erich

Have a b
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1.1.0. Black Rat Snakes
0.1.0. Leopard Gecko

www.erichrhom.com

Is it a juvenile? It has the general appearance of a captive raised juvenile from what I can see: wide growth rings on the scutes, no bold pattern evident yet.

Hard to say if it's EBT or an EBTx.

>>Is it a juvenile? It has the general appearance of a captive raised juvenile from what I can see: wide growth rings on the scutes, no bold pattern evident yet.
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>>Hard to say if it's EBT or an EBTx.

No, it's just a little smaller than the other one.. Bigger than my fist.

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0.1.0. Black Rat Snakes
0.1.0. Leopard Gecko
0.0.2. Box Turtle

www.erichrhom.com

It would be helpful to have something to compare it to: if you could photograph it alongside a ruler or tape measure, for example, that would be a plus. Also, it's weight can be an indicator of age (up to a point), so if you could weigh it, that would provide more info, too.

>>It would be helpful to have something to compare it to: if you could photograph it alongside a ruler or tape measure, for example, that would be a plus. Also, it's weight can be an indicator of age (up to a point), so if you could weigh it, that would provide more info, too.

I'll see what I can do tomorrow. I'll take a side-by-side comparison as well.
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0.1.0. Black Rat Snakes
0.1.0. Leopard Gecko
0.0.2. Box Turtle

www.erichrhom.com

Here's a picture of my box turtle trio for size comparison.

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0.1.0. Black Rat Snakes
0.1.0. Leopard Gecko
0.0.2. Box Turtle

www.erichrhom.com

I'm going with eastern. They can be highly variable, and I've seen one female in MD that looked a bit like an older version of that.

Katrina

Here's a good diet plan developed by a professional herpetologist who's also a box turtle owner.

http://www.matts-turtles.org/docs/Box-Turtle-Diet.pdf

Katrina