Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I have a small colony of rats, about 6.30 breeders and multiple babies or various sizes. Before this problem I maintained anywhere from 150-200 rats. Recently I pulled all my old breeders, as I do every 6 monts, and replaced them with new breeder stock from my own holdbacks. I started this colony about three years ago with 5 rats and have kept it going since without introducing any new blood lines or parasites. before I changed out the old breeders i noticed that the pups were dieing at about 3 weeks of age. I didn't pay too much attention at first because I was feeding off the pinkies to all the baby snakes i hatched. I thought at first that the females were just old and weren't taking care of the pups, as they normaly do. Now that I have all new breeders they are beginning to reproduce rapidly with each new female having 15-20 in a litter. They too at 3, or so, weeks are misteriously dieing. Every day I pull one or two dead baies from each box. I have not changed their food, and I use pine from the local TSC. I have never had this problem, usually i have more rats than I know what to do with. Do I need to risk my entire parasite free colony and introduce new blood? Any one have any ideas or seen this before? I have one litters with 3 pups that are fat and opening their eyes and look good, that is bout 3 out of 100 that have lived in the past month.

picture 1- litter about 2 weeks old, 2 dead pups
picture 2- litter ond day old look healthy mom is taking good care of them
picture 3- this is what is left of a 4 week old litter of about 15.

The 4 week pups dont' look all that healthy either, rather small compared to the 4 week old pups I have in my colony right now.

Why do you think your colony is parasite free? Do you have them checked by a vet regularly? It would be a good idea to bring those pups to a vet specializing in small mammals and see if there is some sort of virus killing them off or parasites or genetic issue.

It is possible genetics from constant inbreeding coming into play but no way to really tell just from the pictures.

The pine shavings you are using seem very fine compared to pine shavings I have seen (though currently I use aspen shavings) but unless the pine has a really extra strong smell lately I don't think it is causing the problem. I have only heard of cedar and pine causing a shortening of life span, not early pup deaths. Since you rotate your adults every 6 months of breeding and its not the adults who are dying, I don't think the pine has anything to do with it either.

At this point I think spending a little money and taking the rat pups to a vet is your best bet. You certainly don't have to tell him you are breeding the rats as food for snakes, you just can tell him the pups are dying off for no apparent reason (bringing the mom of the pups too may be necessary)
-----
PHLdyPayne

Thanks for the info. I had the genetic thing in the back of my mind, I'm not to sure that is it. Who knows? I have changed the bedding to see if that help. The vets around here are so expensive, I could replace all my breeders for what it would cost to go to the vet. Thanks again.

Just an update. I think it was the bedding. I changed the bedding to a highter quality product and I haven't lost one baby. They are all doing great. Thanks for your reply.

Where where you buying the shavings from and what brand?

Thanks,
Bill
-----
2.1 Tripple Het Caramel, Orange Ghost, Genetic Stripe
1.0 Honeybee
1.1 Het Lavenders
1.1 Het Caramel Albino
0.1 Het Albino
0.1 Spider Het Albino
0.1 Het Pied
1,1 Pastel Het for Orange Ghost
1.0 Albino
0.1 Spinner
1.1 Super Pastel
0.1 Jungle Pastel
1.0 Pied 50 percent White
0.1 Clown
0.3 Normal
1.1 Kids
0.1 Spouse
1.0 Chocolate Lab