Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Of what? That is the question... Of balance? Balance is overrated and put above life most times - Big mistake. Specially because we, humans, are too small to see the big picture at work. First, it was the horror; thousands of pythons were taking over the Glades, able to kill even gators, unstopablle. Oh my. So, people started shooting them left and right. But they forgot one simple thing: gators evolved in the glades, they conquered their place there. Pythons did not... and nature always has a last word in these situations. Turns out that both India and Florida are hot, but Florida stills has to deal with Winter. India doesn't. That is the factor why pythons will never quite take over (or did you think that good old Florida herpers didn't also use heat suplies,like the rest of us?). That makes the python hunting a simple case of animal murder and the mother of all hypocrisy, since you now have federal laws stating that you need a permit to own a python, but you can kill them at will and be a national hero. Go figure.

I'm curious as to how other invasive species manage to conquer their new habitats then. The new FL iguanas, the Cuban tree frogs, quite a few anole species, the rabbits of Australia...just to name a few.

I've had a rather nasty day so maybe I'm just being nit-picky. Sorry if I sound offensive.

Laura, 80%-95% of the "new Fl Iguanas" are NOT here anymore. Their DEAD, ALMOST ALL OF THEM ARE DEAD. They succummed to the freeze as well....thanks...In fact ALL the invasives occur now in very small numbers...
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Tom Crutchfield
www.tomcrutchfield.com

really i'm for getting the pythons out of the glades no question about that, by being hunted or a few more cold snaps either way. I'm not into believe in animal rights mammal or reptile. How could I say hey dont shoot those snakes thats wrong, then take it home and feed it cute little bunnies. So I don't, I like snakes some folks like bunnies and i dont think we will be running out of either any time soon.

And the aussies can send me all the rabbits they want, i gotta few small mammal disposal units laying around here somewhere.

Oh and Tom saw you on the tv... well actually youtube... but i'm sure it was on tv somewhere...Inside Natures Giants? Had some folks from england or somewhere over the pond checking out your place...Nice!!!!!! thats like my dream to have a facility...ya know not just a room... well its two rooms now...on my way lol...gotta do it all indoors up here in VA tho...also was really cool seeing all the parts that go into a burm...glad they mentioned hurricane andrew also but i clenched my teeth when they tossed in the But biologist believe blah blah blah owners release. Oh well headed in the right direction atleast...

I think my point was misunderstood.

Firstly, I am far from an AR proponent...just to be clear.

Secondly, we may have had a freeze this year, but the FL ig populations will regenerate. The feral pop I saw in Key West last month looked just fine and there are already a host of babies in Boca. Here in Central Fl, our A carolinensis has been largely outnumbered by the Bahamian and Cuban variety and you are hard pressed to find a native green tree frog.

All the banter can come out, but the original thesis presented was that an invasive species cannot survive in a new habitat with the animals that have naturally evolved there. I'm just saying that has been proved untrue. It has nothing to do with whether or not we want rabbits, or if Florida has lost 75% of its igs in the freeze. With our modern technology, the natural process that one usually sees has been escalated. We can import whatever we want from all over the world, intentionally or unintentionally, and then shelter it, intentionally or unintentionally.

It's not an emotional conversation of us vs them, just an observation.

Here in Central Fl, our A carolinensis has been largely outnumbered by the Bahamian and Cuban variety and you are hard pressed to find a native green tree frog.

While the cold certainly did not wipe out the brown anoles around central fl. it certainly did a number on them. Here in Paisley the greens definitely outnumber the browns right now. another thing I noticed this last week while working (I do landscaping) is the lack of baby brown anoles right now. This is normally the time of year at which point there are bazillions of them. I was chasing a weed eater this saturday and noticed only 3 all day and 2 of them might have been baby greens. This at a time when I would normally be doing my best to not make anole puree while weed eating.
I have not been in Orange or seminole county at night lately so I am not sure about cuban treefrog populations there but I have yet to see any in Daytona, Deland or Deltona. I'm not saying they are gone but I haven't yet seen any. I can tell you for sure that once you get away from the urban areas the green tree fogs (actually I think they're really squirrel tree frogs) barking tree frogs and a few others definitely reign supreme and there are no cuban tree frogs to be found. The native tree frogs around my house will almost make you go deaf at night time.

>>In fact ALL the invasives occur now in very small numbers...
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Hmmm....there are a lot of invasives out there, Tom, lists of them.

Let me qualify my statement then...Brown Anoles, Bufo marinus, Cuban Treefrogs, all exotic Anoles ssp, Green Iguana, Brown Basilisk, ALL HERPS IN GENERAL, plus MANY of the exotic fish spp are here reduced down to very LOW numbers. The Fl Key's didn't freeze and are very DIFFERENT than the mainland of Fl. Brown Anoles are SCARCE here in my yard, so scarce in fact, that I have to now buy them to feed my baby Epicrates as I can't find enough here...All the exotic tropical invasives I'm aware of took a major hit this yeat....
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Tom Crutchfield
www.tomcrutchfield.com

I have been seeing Brown Anoles and Iguanas everywhere. Adults, yearlings and hatchlings.Im down here in miami and I go out looking every day. They may have been hard to find after the freeze but that is not the case now. The only species that seems to have really been hurt by the freeze has been the Burmese. They are not all gone and can still be found but not as easy as before. My property is completly loaded with brown and green anoles. I can go out and see 100 right now. I kind of like that its nice to see them running around.
Gerard

I've been up Griffon Rd several times in Broward where there used to be hundreds and only see one or two. Greynolds Park where there were thousands I didn't see even one and that was 2 weeks ago. Crandon Park which used to have thousands I only saw 3 of them 2 weeks ago. As for my yard [I live in the Redlands which gets colder than Miami] is virtually devoid of sagrei. Where in Miami are you seeing the Green Iguanas? The Iguana hunters that sell to wholesalers tell me their few and far between anymore as are Cuban Anoles and everything else exotic....Yes there are a FEW Pythons being caught but a very small number like hunting for a needle in a haystack. Most Python captures I hear about are along Alligator Alley and the Tamiami Trail under bridges west of here...Around the ENP here their an endangered species now...LOL
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Tom Crutchfield
www.tomcrutchfield.com

I live in the Redlands too. They are every where. I Catch most of the Brown Anoles a mile away from your house. I was in Miami Springs today fishing and there were Iguanas everywhere. Last week I was at Crandon park and they were there too. They took a hit but not 90% are gone.
Gerard

I'm not going to feed the monkey Gerard..LOL
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Tom Crutchfield
www.tomcrutchfield.com

That sounds like a good idea. LOL!
Gerard

Hey Tom, there weren't any iquanas in Greynolds when I was there, either...but there were sure a lot of Tarpon close to 5' in the water.

Jay, he knows it. He's an ex employee by MY choice and therein lies the problem[pardon the pun]....
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Tom Crutchfield
www.tomcrutchfield.com

Hey, I have no problem with you Tom. I was SIMPLY stating my observations from MY hunting trips latley. YOU said there were hardly any IGUANAS and BROWN ANOLES left. I said I have seen ALOT. I dont know where there was a LIE in there. There are Brown Anoles all over your area. I see them all the time. Dont be so defensive. Go look outside you will see them. The Tarpon sound AWSOME though. I have been seeing alot of them on the outside flats but the Muttons have been taking all my time up.
Gerard