Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Ok, I have a pair of app. 6' Ground Boas that have been caged together for the last 8 mos. I've had them. No issues except their ridiculous feeding response..so I feed separately of course.

3 Days ago I moved them into a 4' Vision cage w/belly heat on one side. Prior to that they've been in an AP 4' cage w/a heat panel on one side. Living in Vegas and having one's snake room in a converted garage (well insulated and air conditioned) I only turned the panel on for the last 2 weeks...after moving into the new cage no heat panel. As such they're gone from 84F to 80F but now w/belly heat on one side.

This morning I went out there and the male had the female in a "death coil"..no biting, no copulation, just constricting her in a big ball! I separated them and she was fine, but he started vigorously chasing her in what appeared to be courtship. She fled every advance by him.

He quit after 10 minutes or so and they settled down. An hour later same thing..death coil! I had to separate them again and they're now in separate cages indefinitely. No purposeful cycling, only significant change has been a one hour decrease of the day-cycle as I move towards Fall..and continue to shorten days in the entire room. That and the switch from a short period of heat via the panel now to belly heat.

Anybody experience anything like this before?

Bill

Nope. Just to rule out the thought, are you SURE they are male and female? The description just sounded like the behavior of a lesser male when he's been dominated. They'd "run" but there's no where to go in a cage. That would be the first thing I'd check. I've never had a male constrict a female, or not to the degree I'm picturing from your description. I've had them on top of females, full body clenching, but never wrapped entirely around them constricting.

That possibility had occurred to me as well...its happened before and it will probably happen again when one relies on someone else to sex snakes..LOL. The smaller animal that was almost killed has no visible spurs (unlike the larger obvious male) ans probed only 3 rows deep...barely getting the probe in the vent basically..and I used 2 different diameter probes to be certain.

Would 2 males all of a sudden fight for dominance w/there never being the presence of a female? Its just wierd that all of this started right after a cage change.

Bill

A change may induce a new reaction and a re-establishment of dominance, but it seems pretty odd. Assuming they are a pair, maybe the move just really excited the male? I'd definitely keep a close eye on them. I know in the Reptiles magazine article it stated they keep their Dumerils together year round, but I personally think it's best to keep them seperate and only introduce when attempting to breed. Yeah, they got breeding results, but so do those that keep them seperated. The real difference is in ease of maintaining the animal and the risk reductions that comes with keeping them seperated. Even feeding them in seperate enclosures can bring about negative consequences once they're put back into the enclosure together. A long time ago, I put two retics back together and found myself taking ones head out of the others mouth. That was not fun at all.

I then probed the "dominant" snake and its definitely a male..and the probe-depth was easily twice that of what I had always thought was the female. Only crappy result is I now have to dedicate a large cage to him...one I was planning on using for my male Bar Neck as I get closer to cycling time!

Oh well, time to grovel to the wife about my need for yet another big cage cash layout. Fortunately my B'Day is coming soon so I may be able to cascade a new cage under that umbrella! LOL. Thanks for the opinions!

Bill

If a single cage is large enough, you could just build a divider for the time being. That's some weird behavior though. Without knowing much about the animals, my only thought is the male is ready to breed while the female is not. So, she is trying to get away while he is doing his best to get to business. If that's the case, when the time is right, it looks like you'll have a good breeder male on your hands.

No doubt! I was thinking about throwing him in w/my 11' female Bar Neck to humble him a bit!..Just kidding. I'm very lucky I went into the room when I did though. Otherwise it could have ended up like the BP in the other post though I'd never write a paper about it! If it had gone badly I would have blamed myself and wouldn't memorialize my shortcomings in print!

Just so odd that after a year of peaceful cohabitation a simple cage change could evoke such a radical behavioral change. We've all had or heard about having breedings take place from stubborn animals after a change of scenery or sale...but I've done no climatic changes other than starting the decrease in the light cycle by one hour and the mild temperature changes resulting from the cage swap.

I will look into building a divider.

Bill

I think the barneck could definitely show him who's boss. Those guys are no joke!

Just this year I had a male Dum attack & kill a female. Not sure of what was the cause, BUT it can happen.

I would definetly make sure you have a male & female. Male Dums can be a little territorial.
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Pat Higdon - Higdons Herps, Tuttle, Oklahoma USA
Oklahoma City Herpetological Society Member
4 dumerils boas, 1 bci boa, 3 burmese pythons, 1 albino tiger reticulated python, 2 ball pythons, 1 borneo python, 13 bearded dragons, 6 leopard geckos & 1 sulcata tortoise