Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I bought a baby sand boa and received him yesterday. He is around seven or eight weeks old. They guy I got him from said this boa hasn't eaten yet. I'm trying to get my little guy to eat live pinkies but he shows no interest. How long can he go without eating his first meal. Any info on what I should do would be greatly appreciated.

We need to know the temps, cage setup, etc....???

-Chris
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Christopher E. Smith
Contact
Captive Bred Herps
Wildlife Research & Consulting Services, LLC

He's in a 10 gallon tank with heat mat and red light . Hot end is 93 degrees and the cold end is 73. He has got 2 inches of sand. How long can they go without eating? He hasn't ate since he was born. He seems very skinny but is active. I'm getting ready to have a panic attack...It will break my heart if I lose him.

First of all, relax. The snake has only been in your care for 1 day. I wouldn't even offer it food for a few more days at least.

Secondly, there are around 10 species of sandboa and a dozen or so "morphs" of some species. Which species you have can determine what strategy to use. Yours is probably an East African/Kenyan sandboa, but if it is not, you should tell us first. Getting a young kenyan to eat is a slight different issue thatn a young conicus or miliaris.

There are a few tips on this page - www.kingsnake.com/sandboa/feeding.html - that might help.
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Chris Harrison
San Antonio, Texas

Stick him in a cup (make sure there are holes for him to breath) tonight before you go to bed with a live pinky. Put the cup on the hot spot of the cage. When you wake up tomorrow he should of eaten....if not, post on the forum and someone will walk you through some more aggressive steps.
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Mark Huntley
Sand Boa Morphs

Sand Boa's
2.1 Rufescens
3.6 Albinos
0.1 Hypo Albino
2.1 Dodoma
1.0 Nuclear Meltdown
0.2 Flame
10.22.14 Normal (orange)
7.16 Anery
4.3 Snow
1.5 Yellow Snow
0.1 Splash Albino
1.0 Splash Anery
1.2 Orange Stripe Het Anery
1.1 High Orange Stripe
1.0 Yellow Stripe
1.3 High Orange Tiger
4.5 High Orange
1.1 Snow Paradoxes
0.1 Albino Paradoxes
1.1 Javelin Sand Boas
2.1 Rough Scales
1.1 Indian Sunsets F3

Western Hognose
12.7 Normal Hogs
3.2 Green Phase
2.2 Extreme Red het Albino

2.1 Boston Terriers
0.2 Sooners
1.3 Rhode Island Reds
0.3 Barred Rocks
0.2 Range Hens
0.1 Favorite Wives
1.1 On the fence in-laws
2.1 Rug Rats

CHECK OUT MY NEW KENYAN SAND BOA BLOG
http://sandboamorphs.blogspot.com/

WWW.SANDBOAMORPHS.COM

** Be careful about putting snakes in a cup on the hot spot (you can over-heat them)**

I would give the snake ~1 week to settle in (no handling, etc...) before you try feeding. You might also want to consider putting it in a smaller enclosure.

-Chris
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Christopher E. Smith
Contact
Captive Bred Herps
Wildlife Research & Consulting Services, LLC

This is the sand boa forum, right? These guys can live lost in cars for weeks in the dead heat of summer....the guy has a 93 degree hot spot. The heat increases the snakes body temperature which makes it more active, which makes it more frustrated with that darned pinky that keeps bothering it....only one solution to get some peace.....eat the pinky!!!!

But, yeah, if it gets too hot it could die, but sand boas can take A LOT of heat.
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Mark Huntley
Sand Boa Morphs

Sand Boa's
2.1 Rufescens
3.6 Albinos
0.1 Hypo Albino
2.1 Dodoma
1.0 Nuclear Meltdown
0.2 Flame
10.22.14 Normal (orange)
7.16 Anery
4.3 Snow
1.5 Yellow Snow
0.1 Splash Albino
1.0 Splash Anery
1.2 Orange Stripe Het Anery
1.1 High Orange Stripe
1.0 Yellow Stripe
1.3 High Orange Tiger
4.5 High Orange
1.1 Snow Paradoxes
0.1 Albino Paradoxes
1.1 Javelin Sand Boas
2.1 Rough Scales
1.1 Indian Sunsets F3

Western Hognose
12.7 Normal Hogs
3.2 Green Phase
2.2 Extreme Red het Albino

2.1 Boston Terriers
0.2 Sooners
1.3 Rhode Island Reds
0.3 Barred Rocks
0.2 Range Hens
0.1 Favorite Wives
1.1 On the fence in-laws
2.1 Rug Rats

CHECK OUT MY NEW KENYAN SAND BOA BLOG
http://sandboamorphs.blogspot.com/

WWW.SANDBOAMORPHS.COM

Mark- I agree..... I only put that out as a warning since I have seen it happen.

-Chris
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Christopher E. Smith
Contact
Captive Bred Herps
Wildlife Research & Consulting Services, LLC

Cupping is great, but it has one drawback. You have to handle the snake to put it in the cup. If the snake is really defensive, that will throw off the feeding response. One of the main reasons everyone usually suggests that you not bother the snake for the first few days. Cupping works 98% of the time though.

Lots of ways to help, but here are your main points and most have already been suggested probably.

1. Increase the snakes security. Smaller cage, opaque walls, or just cover the cage up. Light to no traffic, no handling, no noise, no vibrations.
2. Increase heat to increase the snakes appetite. Double edged sword here, because the snakes metabilism will increase causing the snake to have less time to eat before it becomes dangerously weak. 8 weeks old isn't a huge danger signal yet. I've had babies go up to 3-4 months before they started eating. The bigger the baby the longer it can go without food. You describe yours as skinny, so I would try to get it to eat within the next 3 weeks tops. As sad as it is to say, there is a small percentage of babies that will never eat, regardless of what you do. Very small percentage though. Kenyans at least are almost as good as eaters as burmese pythons
3. The right food: Needs to be the right size. In this case I would go with the absolutely smallest live pinky you can find. You do NOT want to trigger a defensive response. Any pinky older than 24hrs should be avoided if possible (not always easy).
4. Place the food in the container the the least amount of fuss. Do not disturb the snake if you can help it.
5. If the first pinky you place in the container is refused, brain it and return it to the container for another night.

Once those steps are done and its still not eating there are other tricks to try. Scenting, reverse scenting, braining, lots and lots of tricks.
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Travis Rose
0.3 Normal Kenyans
2.5 High Orange Kenyans
1.1 Yellow Kenyans
1.1 Albino Kenyans
2.2 Anery Kenyans
1.1 Snow Kenyans
0.1 Paradox Snow Kenyan
0.1 Paradox Albino Kenyan
1.3 Rough Scale Sand Boas
1.2 Indian sand boas
X.X Nervous Rats
X.X Paranoid Mice
0.3 Dogs
0.2 Cats
X.X Fish
0.1 Very understanding wife
2.0 Future Snake Lovers

Wow! Thanks for all the great advice and information! I tried cupping him with a two tiny pinkies and he still hasn't ate so I will just leave him alone for a few days. I'm relieved to hear that some babies can take up to 3 or 4 months to feed, so maybe there is hope for my little fellow. I will post a picture of him below. Cute, huh?

It is a nice looking sand boa.... great color/pattern.

-Chris
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Christopher E. Smith
Contact
Captive Bred Herps
Wildlife Research & Consulting Services, LLC

Beautiful sand boa!

Also, he appears to be a decently healthy weight for his/her age. Hasn't begun to burn body mass for energy yet.

Please note that the 3-4 months are extreme cases. Most feed long before then.

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Travis Rose
0.3 Normal Kenyans
2.5 High Orange Kenyans
1.1 Yellow Kenyans
1.1 Albino Kenyans
2.2 Anery Kenyans
1.1 Snow Kenyans
0.1 Paradox Snow Kenyan
0.1 Paradox Albino Kenyan
1.3 Rough Scale Sand Boas
1.2 Indian sand boas
X.X Nervous Rats
X.X Paranoid Mice
0.3 Dogs
0.2 Cats
X.X Fish
0.1 Very understanding wife
2.0 Future Snake Lovers

Wow your female is a healthy looking girl. Very nice. The picture of my boa makes him look a healthy weight but he's not. I've tried ever trick to get him to feed with no success. Yesterday I called lots of vets to see if they would tube feed my snake they all said no!!! I have never done this to a snake but I tried my best. I think I did it kind of right since he's still alive. The only tube I had looked way to big but it slid down his throat without any resistance I lubed it with strawberry motion lotion. LOL. Does it matter if the tube is large if it goes down easy? How deep should I be putting the tube in on a tiny snake like this? I hope I didn't go to far in, but if I did he would be dead by now, right? The food I gave him was Gerber beef and gravy at 1/2 cc. He seems to look much better today his underside is not sunk in. It's a relief to know he has got some food in his belly. So how long should I wait before feeding him again? Of course I will try live pinkies and then tube again if necessary. You know what's cool?... my other sand boa over eats she's young and ate 10 pinkies in three days. She doesn't care if they are dead or alive she's going to eat them. She's getting big fast. Sorry for all the question I love this little guy and need all the help I can get. You guys are great for helping me out.

'Strawberry Motion Lotion'....I've heard it all now!
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Mark Huntley
Sand Boa Morphs

Sand Boa's
2.1 Rufescens
3.6 Albinos
0.1 Hypo Albino
2.1 Dodoma
1.0 Nuclear Meltdown
0.2 Flame
10.22.14 Normal (orange)
7.16 Anery
4.3 Snow
1.5 Yellow Snow
0.1 Splash Albino
1.0 Splash Anery
1.2 Orange Stripe Het Anery
1.1 High Orange Stripe
1.0 Yellow Stripe
1.3 High Orange Tiger
4.5 High Orange
1.1 Snow Paradoxes
0.1 Albino Paradoxes
1.1 Javelin Sand Boas
2.1 Rough Scales
1.1 Indian Sunsets F3

Western Hognose
12.7 Normal Hogs
3.2 Green Phase
2.2 Extreme Red het Albino

2.1 Boston Terriers
0.2 Sooners
1.3 Rhode Island Reds
0.3 Barred Rocks
0.2 Range Hens
0.1 Favorite Wives
1.1 On the fence in-laws
2.1 Rug Rats

CHECK OUT MY NEW KENYAN SAND BOA BLOG
http://sandboamorphs.blogspot.com/

WWW.SANDBOAMORPHS.COM

Sorry, just saw your reply.

I've tube fed, and it isn't that fun is it? You don't really need to go down that far. Just get it past his mouth (be VERY sure you aren't going into the wind pipe) a little way into his throat and you should be fine. Just make sure he doesn't push it right back out.

I don't know what "strawberry motion lotion" is made of, but I would be very careful of using any lubricant. It would suck to tube feed him only to end up poisoning him.

Baby food doens't really have that many calories per volume. High in water, but that isn't bad. At least its easier to push down. Vets have some higher calorie stuff you can use if you are interested. I'm surprised they did'nt at least offer you some vitamin B to increase his appetite.

I wouldn't tube feed him more than once per week. You want to keep him alive, but not stress him out. Since you have food in him, his organs should be ramping up and his metabolism should be hitting a high note. Chances are, he will be getting hungry soon.
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Travis Rose
1.3 Rough Scale Sand Boas
1.2 Indian sand boas
13.33 Kenyan Sand Boas
X.X Nervous Rats
X.X Paranoid Mice
0.3 Dogs
0.2 Cats
X.X Fish
0.1 Very understanding wife
2.0 Future Snake Lovers

By the way, be glad its a sand boa you are tube feeding. Much more fun than trying to tube feed a ticked off adult boa constrictor all by yourself. Wife did stop by the room from time to time to make sure I was still alive. Good to know she cared
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Travis Rose
1.3 Rough Scale Sand Boas
1.2 Indian sand boas
13.33 Kenyan Sand Boas
X.X Nervous Rats
X.X Paranoid Mice
0.3 Dogs
0.2 Cats
X.X Fish
0.1 Very understanding wife
2.0 Future Snake Lovers

You sure she wasn't stopping by to see if she could call your life insurance man and turn in a claim?
-----
Mark Huntley
Sand Boa Morphs

Sand Boa's
2.1 Rufescens
3.6 Albinos
0.1 Hypo Albino
2.1 Dodoma
1.0 Nuclear Meltdown
0.2 Flame
10.22.14 Normal (orange)
7.16 Anery
4.3 Snow
1.5 Yellow Snow
0.1 Splash Albino
1.0 Splash Anery
1.2 Orange Stripe Het Anery
1.1 High Orange Stripe
1.0 Yellow Stripe
1.3 High Orange Tiger
4.5 High Orange
1.1 Snow Paradoxes
0.1 Albino Paradoxes
1.1 Javelin Sand Boas
2.1 Rough Scales
1.1 Indian Sunsets F3

Western Hognose
12.7 Normal Hogs
3.2 Green Phase
2.2 Extreme Red het Albino

2.1 Boston Terriers
0.2 Sooners
1.3 Rhode Island Reds
0.3 Barred Rocks
0.2 Range Hens
0.1 Favorite Wives
1.1 On the fence in-laws
2.1 Rug Rats

CHECK OUT MY NEW KENYAN SAND BOA BLOG
http://sandboamorphs.blogspot.com/

WWW.SANDBOAMORPHS.COM

Naw, the funeral would cost her more than I'm worth
-----
Travis Rose
1.3 Rough Scale Sand Boas
1.2 Indian sand boas
13.33 Kenyan Sand Boas
X.X Nervous Rats
X.X Paranoid Mice
0.3 Dogs
0.2 Cats
X.X Fish
0.1 Very understanding wife
2.0 Future Snake Lovers

Funeral? You'd just be nutrients in a snake belly.
-----
Mark Huntley
Sand Boa Morphs

Sand Boa's
2.1 Rufescens
3.6 Albinos
0.1 Hypo Albino
2.1 Dodoma
1.0 Nuclear Meltdown
0.2 Flame
10.22.14 Normal (orange)
7.16 Anery
4.3 Snow
1.5 Yellow Snow
0.1 Splash Albino
1.0 Splash Anery
1.2 Orange Stripe Het Anery
1.1 High Orange Stripe
1.0 Yellow Stripe
1.3 High Orange Tiger
4.5 High Orange
1.1 Snow Paradoxes
0.1 Albino Paradoxes
1.1 Javelin Sand Boas
2.1 Rough Scales
1.1 Indian Sunsets F3

Western Hognose
12.7 Normal Hogs
3.2 Green Phase
2.2 Extreme Red het Albino

2.1 Boston Terriers
0.2 Sooners
1.3 Rhode Island Reds
0.3 Barred Rocks
0.2 Range Hens
0.1 Favorite Wives
1.1 On the fence in-laws
2.1 Rug Rats

CHECK OUT MY NEW KENYAN SAND BOA BLOG
http://sandboamorphs.blogspot.com/

WWW.SANDBOAMORPHS.COM

I think you are making a big mistake tube feeding a snake after only a few days. Tube feeding is extremely stressful, potentially dangerous to the snake, and decreases the chance that it will feed by itself soon.

Now that you have a few calories in the snake, don't do anything to it for a week or two. Don't handle it, don't stress it, and certainly don't tube feed it again.

I have had hundreds of baby sandboas over the years and I have tube fed a total of 2. Those two eventually died and never started eating on their own. Every other one started eating on its own without tube feeding.

Have you tried:
- braining pinkies?
- offering fuzzies (sometimes snakes like mice with fur)?
- live vs dead pinkies?
- offering a handful of live pinkies (a nest of mice)?
- feeding at night/day/dusk?
- start feeding (putting a pinkie in the snake's mouth the freezing)?
- being patient?

I have had a number of sandboas that went 6-8 months before they took their first meal. East African/Kenyan sandboas are usually not that tough.
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Chris Harrison
San Antonio, Texas

Chris, Hey thanks for your info! Yes I have tried everything you listed expect for fuzzy pinkies/mice. There is no way he could eat those as his head and mouth can't take that large of prey. I put him over night with 6 newborn pinkies and in the morning I killed and stuck a hole in a pinkies brain and he still didn't eat. I tried scenting the pinkies with lizard and chicken broth. I tried live and dead pinkies in a small cup. I pushed a pinkie against his nose till he opened his mouth and push it in a bit but he spit it out. Nothing has worked. Trust me I wish I didn't need to tube feed but he needed it and looks much better now. I know I haven't had him that long but he never ate for his breeder and had a very sunken belly when he arrived. The breeder also told me he was one of the smallest in the litter. The breeder was very honest with me about him... other than shipping my snake with ups which is not allowed with the company and it took a extra two days for my snake to arrive. When he arrived he was almost 9 weeks of age.

Also I would love to know formula or somewhere I can buy food that is nutritionally sound for tube feeding so if I have to do it again I will be prepared.

I just put my little boy in with three newborn pinkies. I hope he eats one tonight but I'm thinking he's not going to and will need to tube feed again. Please let me know if you have good recipe for tube feeding.

What is the snake's weight? As Chris H. mentioned, tube feeding is the LAST resort and at 9 weeks shouldn't be necessary. I have had a couple kenyans go as long as 5-6 months and start feeding.

Be VERY patient (don't even look at the snake for 1-2 weeks). Make sure it has 2-3 of substrate to burrow in (I prefer aspen). Make sure the warm side is between 95-100F and the cool side is 75-80F.

As stated above, sometimes snakes just don't make it.....

Best of luck,
Chris
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Christopher E. Smith
Contact
Captive Bred Herps
Wildlife Research & Consulting Services, LLC