Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Check out the Hognose forum. I posted a quick question to see how long baby hogs would camp in the egg and as I scan through posts.. everyone one of them is "check my color phase out", "hey i just hatched this is it a super conda mocha phase?"...

To summarize, the Ball Python crowd has moved right into hognose apparently. Not one post about locality hogs. I am proud to have my pair of F1 hogs from the same small stretch of road in West Texas and now some of their offspring.

Have any of these guys ever actually attempted to look for hogs in the wild? Or are they all just color phases and dollar signs?

Just my .02

StevenX

They all see dollar signs. Then there are breeders out there who like to discredit other peoples animals to sell more of theirs. Money is the root of all evil and a lot of these people need to make sure they don't quit their day jobs.
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Steve W.

I dont want to discredit any work or quality put into animals.. Just wonder if any of these folks actually appreciate the animals... not just the greenbacks.

Many appreciate the animals and don't just do it for the money. The easy test to tell is when you hatch something out that's rare or different and the big breeders come out of the woodwork and try to get the animal from you. lol
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Steve W.

I have personally collected hognose in the wild. The hogs that I have are all pure locality kennerlyi, with the exception of a pair of albinos that I picked up from a buddy earlier this year. I don't care about the money. Although, I do think its cool to produce something out of the ordinary.

Kyle

You are correct, the BP mentality has invaded the hog scene.

When you see ads that show a hog on a scale to show weight, there is a clue. Now, it doesn't mean the seller is completely overtaken by thoughts of millions, of course, but that type of marketing turns me off.

I have also never seen so many FAT hogs in my life. Take a look at pics these days, everyone is in a mad rush to get them to breed as quick as possible, by providing a chinese buffet basically every feeding time.

It does seem that the mentality is to breed each and everything. I don't see a lot of insightful discussion about hogs, in regards to subjects regarding field work, and basic facts.

I do wish there were more locality breedings. I have one friend who has been breeding locality MN hogs for many, many years.
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Genesis 1:1

Steven,

I feel your pain. I am the only breeder of locality gloydi out there that I know of. Every time I post photos of some of these animals, the response is minimal (and they are VERY nice hognose, locality or not). My breeder stock is from within a quarter mile of each other (which is TOUGH to do). I have been breeding locality gloydi and kennerlyi for over twenty years and do not plan on stopping. Some people do actually care, although not nearly as many as do about alterna. I really do not care what the specie, I prefer to breed for locality. Not to sound like a hypocrite, I do breed hognose morphs as well.

To keep this on topic, I am stoked that you guys produced the F1 Huecos. I hope to be doing the same thing soon. I am still waiting for my 1st alterna of the year to hatch. I should have some super cool ones. I will post pics as soon as they are out and have shed.

Bryan

So what.

yup
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Chris - TX

Very well said Steven..
Nathan

why so many in this hobby/business need to feel their beliefs and way of doing things are the only correct way. I have no dog in this hunt as I haven't bred hogs in years but can't help but notice this is one of those classic examples of people feeling the need to throw blanket judgements over another group. There are surely some doing it just for the money just as there are some breeding ball pythons just for the money but their are others that take great care of theirs and do it because they enjoy it and appreciate the snakes.
Sorry to offend any of you but I'm just saying.

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Randy Whittington

Well said, Randy. I breed and love my locality Trans-Pecos Mexican hognose, but I also breed lots of non-locality nasicus-and I spend tons of time out in the field with wild herps of all kinds (below is a pic of a personally collected kennerlyi). Additionally, I keep and breed albinos and other morphs. It's all good. Why should I dis others just for having different interests from my own?

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Brad Chambers
WWW.HCU-TX.ORG

Boas, Pythons, Colubrids, Tortoises and Turtles

Its more of a mentality than anything else. I notice this because every picture I see in the forums has the question below it.. "is this a xxx phase"... "could this be a xxx phase".

Here's a thought. Worry less about the phase of the animal, and more about the health and the natural history of the animal.

I am not offended by your opinion. I am not a very nice guy for a reason... I know folks are going to make money. I don't have a problem with it. The problem I have is that when every snake is just chunk o'change and a color morph.

StevenX

I pretty much agree with you Randy. I think in this hobby or business there is plenty of room for all. I have looked for greybands and hognose but I still like the morphs of each. I just don't hardly ever voice my opinion on the forums like a lot of people do. Some of the people get carried away with their opinions, especially on the kingsnake forum. I do think it just like the Ball Pythons there are a lot of pretty animals that people like to look at. Also a lot of people do not have the time to go out to try to find animals since they are trying to make a living. Just my 2 worth.

Sorry to interupt. To Don Shores. The snake you posted is fantastic! Some information please and where can I get one?
Holding my breath for your reply.LOL
theOLDherper
Pete

Pete, that is a black Christmas Mountain alterna and I think you can get them from Adam Sweetman.

Don,
Thank you--deep breath--I will try to make contact with him.
There are so many facets to any collecting hobby that there is no way that everyone will ever agree to the same things. Back in the late '50s when I started into reptile collecting I had a familly to support so I tried to make my hobbies self supporting as not to dig into the budget. I am sure that many others did the same thing.
Later, when the captive breeding got popular the whole snake collecting hobby went through a big change as some looked at it as a way to make some big bucks. More power to them. Myself, I still prefer the OLD hobby way. To each his own, no use in fighting about it.
theOLDherper
Pete

P.S.
Adam Sweetman - where are you?

...don't buy'em

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Snakes to the Max

10char........

I hope you all do not mind a comment from an old fart. To me it does not seem to really matter what anyone or everyone thinks about this. If I were able to please everybody with what I were doing, I might have a dog in this fight. Seems to me that you, me, or anyone is going to do what they want to do for the reasons they want. Like some have said, if you want color go for it, if you want locality go for it. Whether you are doing it for science, hobby, or business the real BIG issue here is that you be honest about it. "I am just saying" ha ha.

ECTimaeus

To each is own i guess. There are people trying to make money in every thing we do. It sucks that there are people out there breeding reptiles just to turn a profit and could care less about the animals they keep. Thats the industry part of it. People breeding locality animals can be just as bad as morph breeders. I bet no one here would breed Huecos and sell them for the same price as more common localities such as 277 or langtrys. I'm sure it goes beyond morphs, and localities. I don't like seeing people produce these mutt hybrids just to get a different color and pattern because they think it will sell better. I would like to think a good percentage of us keep herps because we enjoy them. What i hate seeing more than anything are these guys on TV collecting rattlesnakes and selling them to roundups for profit and glamourizing it. Taking snakes from the wild just so they can be killed is absolute BS. Just my opinion.

Chris

and i should have mentioned i have no problem with morphs or localities. I prefer locale animals.

Chris

I have caught my share of hogs in the wild, but don't have any desire to remove any more from the wild....that's just me. And yes, I want to be able to produce different color morphs...not for the money so much as to just have them and be able to admire them. I do sell some offspring, and I like to have my sales cover the expenses of the hobby. Would I like to make some real$$ if I could? Sure..and so would you. If I was David Turcotte and produced the lavender hog, I would get every penny I could. I know that David does this for the enjoyment, just as I do, but he had a golden egg laid in his lap. OK, so they aren't locale animals. Few of them are. (The same as the animals for sale in the alterna classifieds.) All I can say is, to each his own...if locale is your thing, do it. No need slinging mud at those with differing opinions and interests. My generic alterna are just fine with me.
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Greg Jackson

There's nothing wrong with morphs or generics of any animal. What is wrong is when the dollar signs cloud the real beauty of the hobby.
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Steve W.

" There's nothing wrong with morphs or generics of any animal. What is wrong is when the dollar signs cloud the real beauty of the hobby. "

EXACTLY!!!! I could not have said it better myself.

Locality Sanderson:

True locality Okeetee corn, one of my most cherished snakes in my collection:

Generic Blairs:

Locality or generic, they are all incredible, and a privilege to
own!!

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Genesis 1:1

Nice animals.
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Steve W.

Thank you sir!
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Genesis 1:1