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I just recently made a deal with a man who received a albino coral boa from a rescue who has mouth rot. I am going to get the snake off of him and a bring it to the vet and bring it back to full health. If anyone has any tips on treating mouth rot like what to treat it with, how often, best method to do so, ect it would be very helpful. Thank you

Many years ago, I got a Colombian Boa rescue that had such horrible mouthrot(infectious stomatitis) that it had rotted through the roof of the snake's mouth and had tiny maggots crawling out of it's nostrils. I nursed it back to 100% perfect health in very short order doing these simple steps.....

1) gently pry the mouth open with a plastic spoon, etc.. and turn it cide-ways to "prop" the snake's mouth open so you can work on it. This is quite easy to do.

2) Remove all rotted "cheesy" looking tissue along with any loose teeth.

3) turn snakes head just a bit side-ways and rinse the mouth well with hydrogen peroxide a couple times to allow it to fizz a good bit. You can also apply a bit of Betadine which works well too and stains the bad part of the tissue to help you in identifying the bad tissue that needs to be removed.

$) do this at least twice a day every single day for several days and you should immediately start to notice a big difference. But do not stop the treatments. Keep doing this for about a good week or so until you see it getting totally back to normal and the mouth looking good and perfectly closed once again.

Keep in mind though, it is EXTREMELY important to note if the snake also has a SECONDARY RI (Respiratory Infection), because this can be quite common to have two problems going at the same time. Either of which(or both) will prevent the snake from feeding voluntarily as well. in which case warm the snake into the mid-90's and seek veterinary help ASAP for the administration of antibiotcs that will properly target the infection after a saliva bacteria culture has been performed to know what antibiotics will BEST target the given type of bacteria.

If you have some mouth rot that isn't way out of control yet, you should have no problem with getting the snake back to normal so long as you follow the steps to the letter.

hope the snake pulls through quickly!..

~doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com

remember when you are tilting the snakes mouth a bit to the side, that you also tilt the head slightly down when rinsing with the solution as well. This helps get everything OUT of the mouth and also helps prevent any peroxide/betadine from going down the glottis(wind pipe) located towards the front of the bottom jaw by the tongue hole.

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com

Thank You!! That was exactly what I was looking for. The guy said he already brought it to the vet once and it received a shot. He said he is planning on doing it one more time before he gives the snake to me. I will follow these directions to the T. I will also post pics as soon as I get the snake to show the progress. Again, thank you very much.

Luke

Also, if he does have a RI what would be the best medication to buy to treat him at home after the vet? or would the vet give him a prescription of some sort? Thanks for your time.

Luke

Good deal!, and you're welcome........

Well, if it does have an RI as well, there are some wide-spectrum antibiotics that can often help, such as Amikacin, Gentomycin, and Baytril, Cloramphenical, etc... But there are different gram negative and gram positive bacteria and the only way to know exactly what type of antibiotic will target the particular bacteria is by doing a simple culture. This isn't very expensive and will prevent you from spinning your wheels not using an antibiotic that is effective and prevent the snake's condition from worsening in the meantime.

I really don't advise administering the antibiotics yourself, because the dosing has to be accurate and certain additional things have to be well understood for additional support such as fluids depending on which is used. But here are some common reptile drugs and their dosages........

Antibiotics:

Note: Never use piperazine or ivermectin on any turtle. Both have been demonstrated to have toxic, if not lethal, effects on turtles.

Amikacin 2.5 mg/kg every 72 hrs IM up to 5 mg/kg for 48 hr with fluid support
Amoxicillin 10 mg/kg per d for 7 d SQ w/aminoglycosides
Ampicillin 10 mg/kg per d for 7 d SQ up to 20 mg/kg q d
Baytril (enrofloxacin) 5 mg/kg per d for 10 d SQ

Ceftriaxone 50 mg/kg per d for 7 d SQ .
Chloramphenical 50 mg/kg per d for 7 d SQ .
Gentamicin 2.5 mg/kg every 72 hours IM up to 10 mg/kg for 48 hr w/fluid support
Tetracycline 50 mg/kg per d for 7 d SQ .
Trimethoprim-Sulfa 30 mg/kg per d for 7 d PO .
Tylocin 5 mg/kg per d for 7 d SQ .
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com

Like Doug warned, I received a young boa once with mouthrot and RI, as the two can both be the result of bad husbandry.

The mouthrot was treated as Doug explained, and it cleared up very quickly. I used Betadine instead of peroxide, but both work. I took the snake to the vet for the RI, and he prescribed Baytril. That infection cleared up quickly as well. Boas are tough snakes, and due to their larger size are more easily treated. I have no doubt your snake will be fine if treated asap.

And keeping the snake warm and hydrated helps make the recovery all that much easier for the snake. Treating the snake but keeping it at 75 deg does not do much. Make sure it has access to an 80-90 deg range. A soak in very shallow 80 deg water for 5 minutes will hydrate the snake better than a water bowl.

Thanks guys, the information you have given me would have taken hours to find on the web and then i would not have known if it is reliable. I pretty much copied and pasted it all and made reference documents on my desktop. This forum is the best! lol Also real quick Doug, should i keep the snake at that high temp during recovery day and night or just during the day?

To help raise the snake's natural metabolism that helps fight off infection, I would definitely keep the snake in the very upper 80's to about 92 all the time until things get better. But monotor this CAREFULLY and ACCURATELY with an accurate thermometer, temp probe and/or good laser temp gun at the belly surface where the snake actually makes contact to prevent a big accident with temp spikes. Mark was also spot-on regarding hydration too. Boas naturally don't do well in cooler dry temps anyway, and should typically be kept in the lower to mid 80's with a basking spot on one end in the low 90's with a fairly high humidity level. Some slight drop at night is fine normally, but temps on the warmer side of their normal range would be very beneficial right now in helping it fight the mouth-rot and possible RI. As we both stated, I guarantee very poor husbandry is what started this situation from the previous owner. I'm glad you are working on getting the snake back on track to a thriving healthy life.

Good luck, and let us know how things go with it..

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com

BTW Mark, very nice T-pos. there man!..

~Doug
-----
"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com

Alright that all makes perfect sense. I will definitely follow the directions everyone has helped put together. Again, thank you all for the input. I'll keep everyone updated as soon as I get the snake.

Luke Deer

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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com

Just wanted to add a few comments to the above thread concerning the use of the antibiotics you have listed.

The aminoglycoside antibiotics amikacin and gentamicin are typically never dosed above 2.5 mg/kg with boids due to the potential of adverse toxic effects and additionally, fluid therapy has not been found to be necessary other than supplying fresh, easily accessible water daily.

Amoxicillin, ampicillin, trimethoprim-sulfa and tetracycline have been proven to very rarely be effective with most boid infections due to their limited spectrum of activity, however doxycycline, a tetracycline relative, has been found to be effective in some cases.

The fluoroquinolone class antibiotic Baytril or enrofloxacin, has been found to be fairly effective, but ciprofloxacin, or Cipro another fluoroquinolone, has been found to be even more effective than Baytril and is a good choice for RI’s and other infections in boids.

Chloramphenicol has a pretty good spectrum of antibacterial activity, but it has the one drawback of causing an area of tissue damage or necrosis around the injection site. It will typically leave half-inch diameter permanent scars around each injection site on the snakes body.

Ceftriaxone is a third-generation cephalosporin class antibiotic and is one of the best I have seen for the treatment of severe cases of stomatitis, or mouth rot. However, I would not recommend 50 mg/kg per day as this would be approaching toxic levels. A better, safer choice would be 25 mg/kg per day. I have seen this dosage used with excellent results.

Tylosin is a macrolide class antibiotic and is mainly effective against only specific gram-positive species of bacteria. It is mainly used to treat chronic RI in boids that have re-occurring infections that do not respond to other antibiotics. These have been shown to many times be caused by bacteria of the genus Mycoplasma. As such, it has been shown that Tylosin will rarely be effective against any other bacterial species aside from Mycoplasma.

Finally, your suggestion to keep substrate temps at 90 to 92 with any antibiotic therapy on boids is definitely correct, and I might add that it is imperative to keep the ambient humidity between 70% and 80% during those periods of elevated temperatures. Thanks,

Kelly

Great info Kelly!,.......I was aware of some of those details and precautions you mentioned on the dosages, but not necessarily all of them. Thanks for adding those fine details for the specific antibiotics.

This would also be a great thing to copy and print out for the vet to see, as you are no doubt all too aware that many vet's are not so knowledgeable regarding reptile medications.

I will also keep this info in a folder file for future reference myself..

cheers, ~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com

I seem to recall reading a long time ago of some terrible abcesses that were displayed after the use of Baytril, but I have no idea what the particular details were on the dosing that was given. That would be a great help to know.

But anyway, what do you think of this particular regimen that is recommended in the book......"The Complete Boa Constrictor" p. 78 that has been said to have been used with good results?

"10 milligrams per kilogram body weight given intramuscularly for the first dose, then 5 milligrams per kilogram body weight given intramuscularly every 48-72 hrs... Administration of this product can be painful and cause tissue necrosis, sterile abcesses and skin discoloration. Large doses (greater than 1cc/ml) should be divided and given in 2-3 different sites to minimize tissue damage."

This seems to make good sense I am thinking

thanks........

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com

I need everyone's opinion please. The snake I originally posted this post about is in the possession of a flipper. I have come by information that the guy takes sick reptiles and trys to get rid of them as fast as possible before they die. I could still get the snake but I doubt the only thing it has is mouth rot. Also his claims that he has taken him to the vet are probably false. Should I still get the snake and try to treat it or is the risk too great to my other snakes?

Luke Deer

Unfortunately this is something in this hobby that does happen with unscrupulous irresponsible sellers. I feel extremely sad for the animals themselves that are involved with this, but it in your best interest to avoid these animals at all costs in my opinion. I would also fully agree with you and bet a dollar to a donut that this person never set foot into a vet's office with this snake, and is all a fabricated lie to make it "seem" a bit more promising.

Thing is, you could save the snake's life, OR you could be wasting time and money needlessly. It is purely a "crap shoot" as to how this would pan-out.

This is one aspect of this hobby that is truly sad. The poor animals are always the ones that pay the price..

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com

Now if you did decide to acquire the snake in hopes of getting it better, I would HIGHLY recommend that you totally quarantine the animal in another seperate room so there is no chance of spreading any sickness or disease to the other snakes in your collection. And any tools, containers or bowls, etc.. should never go into the main snake room either that have made contact with, or have been used in close proximity to this snake as well.

regards, ~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com

Doug,
In response to your earlier question, there have been reports of tissue damage or necrosis at the site of injection when using Baytril with reptiles. Sometimes it will cause problems and then sometimes not, however it is a risk. I have heard of the procedure you described in your post to help minimize the damage and it does help. Another option which appears to work even better is to not only keep the volume of any injection site at 1cc or less as in your post, but to also dilute the injected Baytril to 50% before hand to lower the concentration as well. The total dosage of the Baytril is unchanged, but just spread out so as not to be as concentrated in the tissue. For example, instead of injecting 1cc of Baytril at one site on the animal, dilute the concentration by half with sterile water for injection, and then you will be injecting 2cc of solution, 1cc at each of two sites on the animal. This lower concentration of Baytril at each injection site seems to help to avoid the tissue damage. Just make sure that you use the actual product of sterile water for injection to make these dilutions.

On the dosage regimen for Baytril, the initial double dosage of 10 mg/kg is called a loading dose and is safe when using Baytril as it is relatively non-toxic and has a pretty good margin of error regarding toxicity. This is done to obtain a rapid and high initial serum concentration of a given medication, and then falling back to the standard dosage for all subsequent dosages. Loading doses with aminoglycoside antibiotics for example, like gentamicin, amikacin, and tobramycin would be of more risk due to their increased toxicity and in those cases a lot would depend on the actual species being treated.

Kelly

Yes, that all makes perfectly good sense to me......thanks for the info there!..

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com

yea I decided not to get the albino coral from him. Too much risk to my other snakes because the guys a flipper. I feel bad for the snake, but there's only so much you can do. Thanks

Luke Deer

Your welcome......I don't blame you a bit either. It's too bad too, because it didn't have to be that way for the snake(s) the guy is flipping. If he wanted to(which he obviously doesn't), he could nurse them back BEFORE he sells them (well, a good number of them anyway)........sad..

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com