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What kind of temps do you lads use for your adult rhino? Mine is 3 years old now and I think I am going to lower mine this summer. I usually have the basking spot at about 130-135 on top of the huge retes stack I built. I have noticed this year during the day he stays hidden under the cool part of the retes stack and doesn't bask but only about 10 mins and then sits on cool. He used to sit there for hours. I read up on this some and theres information from 95 degree basking to 120 degree basking. So i thought i would ask people that actually have them. I am pretty sure I need to lower basking from 135 to about 110-115. Thanks in advance for the input!

nope, its good where it is. Do you want him to sit under the light all day??
You are giving him useable temps. He only needs it for 10 min, thats great, he is regulating his temps. Igs that sit under their light all day are trying to warm up to where they want to be but are not given high enough temps to achieve optimum temps. I dont know what you read or from where but those temps are too low even for a green ig, thats old school thinking. The book you should be reading is Lemm's book, CYCLURA. SDZ/CRES use 150 basking temps. I've measured temps that high being used in the wild.
Why do you think its to high?

jf

Well i have the same book and as i read on page 104 it says they have been known to bask at temps as high as 150f,it doesnt say your basking spot has to be 150f.I'm not questioning anybody or saying anybody is right or wrong.But not everybody keeps theres outside as myself i keep mine inside and my rhino and cuban bask at 110f to 115f basking spot being mine arent adults yet,and they sit under there megaray almost all day and sometimes go to the cool side of there cage and i have no problems with either of them growing,plus i give good diet,my cuban is 6 months old and 16'',my russets was 15 months old and 31''.All measured from head to tail.And i check my temps with a temp gun.It does say higher temps seem to be most successful,with breeding to.

its about choice for you cyclura. If the ig wants to get higher temps it can. Of course your lizard will bask at 110-115 thats all you are giving it. They dont bask all day. if yours do its because they have to and the temps are too low. The point is to give them the heat range they need when they want it. you are deciding 115 is good enough, I think you should let the lizard decide, higher temps allows them to do that.

jf

Hey i was replying to were you had stated what was in the book as it stated,and also mine bask for a good part of the day being there kept under megaray bulbs and not the natural sun so yes they do bask under there most of the day thanks.Dont you keep ur outside jf??And mine seem to be growing fine as ive been keeping this way for years and its works for me and my cyclura.I was just stating what works for me.These forums are to post and help and learn.

And nothing for nothing i called rob ehrig to get his point of view this afternoon and he said my temps at 100f are perfect,i dont need to go 150f he said thats just crazy.I guess would bask all day to hot.And honestly i m not saying anybody else is wrong or right but ill take his point of view anytime,along with others.So i guess everybody can learn things new .

No I dont keep them out all year. You seem to be hooked on a specific number, that is not my point. Mine are inside and dont need to bask all day, and dont. You posted the question and are defending your actions, so why did you ask?

jf

russets, you didn't post the question. My bad.
please disregard my last sentence.

jf

Well my main thing was he just was acting different than he ever has. He hides a lot more now under the retes stack and I felt him after basking for 10 mins and he was like a flaming fire from the high basking temps. He doesn't seem stressed or scared. When I come up the the cage and open it he comes out and crawls up my arms and sits on my shoulder wanting fed. I tested and put a smaller wattage bulb in and it's about 120 now and I am going to see if he is out more. On the basking side I have 125watt solar glo and a 10.0 repti linear bulb on that side as well. Other end of the cage is around 75-80, which he is never on that side. Bottom of the retes stack is around 90s. Jungle earth substrate in case someone ask.

It sounds like everything is fine. Good for you for experimenting. If you want him under the light more, yes lower the wattage and he will stay there because it takes longer for him to hit his optimum temp if he gets to it at all. Hes in the stack cuz he found the temp he likes, the point I was trying to make is that you are giving him a choice of temps and let him decide. opposed to deciding the ig only get 100-110 because the keeper thinks thats enough.
I'll stop now so I dont dig deeper

jf

Well i mean dig all u want,i just was trying to see what was the right way to go as far as basking temps,so i turned to rob ehrig who has been working with these guys for over 35 plus year,not saying anybody else is wrong or right.There's to many people on forms who seem to think they know everything,when they dont.I respect everybodies thoughts or help so thx.

I will post back how the lower wattage bulb works. I do love the retes stacks though. All my lizards have them now, so easy to make and the temp rage they offer is well worth the space. It's easy to have like a 40 degree span over a 3 foot tall retes.

I agree with jf. I have more than 100 Cycluras and although adults are kept outside, I agree that the hot spot should be between 130 to 150. I was totally shock the other day when in the middle of a sunny day, I found more than half of my adult rhinos still in their attached houses and not outside. When I check the temperature of one of the house, it was 116 and they seem very comfortable. They have free choice to go in an out as they please and more than half decided that it was fine for them to stay in a house at 116. My only concern I have with this high basking spot is that the cage should be large enough so that iguana can fully get away from the hot spot to a cool area where it can be in the 80s. In this situation, they will choose their comfort zone. What jf is saying is that we should give them the choice to choose where they want to be, instead of leaving it up to "the human experts."

here is a link to my FB page if you want to check out some of my animals.

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Tys-Lizards/188828187820956

Well not a human exspert,but i got my answer,and some people still think they are exsperts whether you keep one rhino or 50.

Well....unlike some people jf is an expert.

Well i never said anybody was a expert.And as for jf i think shes very smart person forsure.But she has her ways and others have there's bottom line.I thank everybody for there help.

Also anybody can buy hundreds of cyclura iguana if you have the money and keep them outside feed them and say they know alot about cyclura,not saying any names.I've kept iguanas/cyclura for over 15 years but i still learn new things all the time.

You are really hung up on "expert". All I did is offer a thought process. Erhig is a legend in captive cyclura, much respect, but based on what you said he said, I disagree. If you want to blindly obey what ever he says thats your right. I did the homework. Lewisi have shown they prefer to keep their core temp between 100-105. I would assume cornuta, all the bigger cyclura, the same, I could find the info, cornuta temps are not at my fingertips.
Why would you just have a 100 or lower basking spot???? Yeah it will survive, and even eat and grow. The way I think- its my job as a keeper to give my captive the best, most optimum environment to spend its captive days. Its a constant quest.
I bet you can live and grow on nothing but chocolate cake. Is it really the best thing for you. will you reach your potential?
You just dont agree, so you tag me as an "expert" in that know it all kinda way. I just tried to help his, your, lizard

jf

I'm hung up on expert thing,my eyes are fine but maybe you need to read who started the th i didnt start the expert thing ,ty said something about human expert.Jf you can disagree all u want its a forum and you do things ur way and others do it theres.I did my homework as well,and i agree with rob ehrig simple.And i dont have to agree with you so thats my right.All my cyclura i've had did great on temps 100f to 110f,and grown better than some who raise theres outdoors,so i must be doing something right.Hey i'm here to help,learn,thats all so i respect everybodies input,but at the end of the day ill do what works for my cyclura.

You go girl! its your lizard. Funny how you take the"hey im just here to learn, and help" stance and still take veiled shots people. You brought up "exspert"

jf

Maybe u cant read get ur eyes check,ty said something about exspert,i didnt take shots at anybody,i was saying it the way it is.I said you were smart person and then you came back with u go girl,really lol,you know what i dont care if you think ur somebody on here or not,i have a right to say what i feel to,if you dont like it dont respond then ok very easy can you read that.

Well....i guess because i have money and can buy 100s of iguanas i don't know what i am doing (didn't say it but implied.) That's OK because that comes from some one who is totally stuck and are not willing to learn...oh well. FYI, all my animals are going great and yes I am learning all the time...even though I have been keeping reptiles for more than 50 years. I know Robert E. and he has visited my facility and I have visited his. He keeps most if not all Cycluras outdoors close to Key West. I know you talked to him but I don't believe he told you that hot spot of 100 to 110 is correct. To me...that is insanely low for keeping Cycluras. He might do fine when healthy but you are not giving him any chance for him to get to a temperature he needs...especially if he gets sick. I have noticed in the past that lizards choose to give themselves "fever" when they are not well. Since you are doing fine, keep doing what you are doing and since you are throwing Robert E. name around here, please ask him to respond here directly. We have two different opinions here...that's great...that is how we learn...from different opinions. I just hate it when the information provided can harm iguanas that I love dearly and in most cases that would be true if hottest spot in the cage is only between 100 to 110.

Listen i dont care if you Believe me or not,he told me i could use his mame,he told me he was at ur place and you bought ten russets rhino's off him,i've bought off him for years as well.How am i stuck i didnt start the thread can u read damn.You been keeping reptiles for 50 years you know what good for u ty.Another thing why would i say rob said keeping my rhino's basking temps at 100f was ok if the man didn't say it i have know reason to lie,nothing to gain from it.If you dont believe me call the guy you been to his place sure you know his number.Temps over a 110f for a long time would kill a rhino sorry,and i know you said they should have the opition to bask were they choose as far as temps.Its funny my rhino's do great and there basking spot is 102f,never had a problem.Ill called rob and ty he said you only been doing it for four years,and he was at ur place two years ago how would i know this??But at the same time im talking to him now .They get fever i dont think so never heard of that whatever.

Look....let's not make this you, jf, Bob and me issue. The bottom line is we have two different opinions and the reader has to make up your own mind. You are saying hot spot of 110 is fine and we are saying it is best to give them hot spot Spot of 130 to 150 is best as long as the cage is big enough so that the iguana can get away from the hot spot to a cooler area of 80s. Let the readers decide what is right for them.

Hey and i agree with ya,but rob had no issues with anybody but again i was told bye him to use his name was never lying about anything.But i agree lets move on.

I think this thread could be considered a "HOT TOPIC." lol

Hey Manny.... Dude.... Stop teasing and give us you opinion. I know you got one

Ty said they give themselves a fever when sick not that they get a fever. What he was getting at is that when some(not sure if all) lizards get sick such as a respitory infection or the such they actually bask at much higher temps to raise their body temp to help fight off the infection. I believe this was first discovered back in the 80's in a study at the University of Mich. Some desert iguanas were injected with some sort of virus or maybe even a bacterial infection(can't remember as it has been some time). There were several study groups. The optimum prefered temp for a desert iguana is like 104F. That was what the uninjected(is that a word LOL) iguanas liked to maintain there body temp at. The injected iguanas maintained their body temp like 10 degrees higher or something like that until they were able to fight off the infection then dropped back down to their o.p.t.. It was a pretty cool study. I got to see the set-up and they had these big sandbox types enclosures setup with different study groups. Anyway I hope this sheds a little light on what Ty and Joel were trying to say. They did not call you out on the temps you called them out and they are only arguing their point.

I keep chuckwallas, alot of them, and I maintain my basking spots at about 135f. I have been out to the desert many times and I know their basking temps get way higher. I only use the lower temps because my cages are not big enough so they can get to a cool enough spot if I used a 160 F spot. I have had some get infections(bacterial abcess type infections) in the past and let me tell you they lay under that spot ALMOST non-stop. It gets to the point sometimes where I move them because I (the human expert LOL)thinks it is too hot and they they will die. It usually ends up that I give antibiotics to cure the infection. Would they be able to fight it off if they had a higher basking temp? I don't know.

Anyway just some info to think about. I have no doubt these guys are wired to know when they have a problem and adjust their movements or routines as to give themselves a better chance at survival so if you give them a range from 80 to 150 they are able to do just that. So yes you may be able to maintain perfectly healthy iguanas at your temps(if the spot is so they can get to o.p.t. but if something were to go wrong they might not be able to fight it off. You are able to maintain a more secure environment indoors and keep them from any viral or bacterial infection where they might need the higher temps. In the wild or in outdoor enclosures they may not be able to keep such a secure environment. In a more detailed explanation and I am not saying these temps are correct(I really do not know)it is just an example. Let's say a rhino's opt is 102 and your spot is 110 and he gets in there and heats up to 104 so he moves to his cooler area, cools off then moves back under the light and so on. Then one day he gets a bug and he says wow I need to up my temp to fight off this bug and let's say that temp is 116 and he is never able to get there you then may get a sick lizard.

Anyway I hope this helps shed a little more light on the subject. Yes there is more than one way to get similar results. These guys are just saying what research shows. I know that Joel and Ty both do their homework and are only trying to convey what the research shows. They are not just pulling these numbers off the top of their heads. I believe Joel made a reference that stated when they went to the higher basking temps breeding success went up. So it sort of makes sense the higher temps may be beneficial. I am just going by what I am getting from this thread. I do not keep cyclura nore do I have the book refered to in this thread.

Ok more than just info on the fever thing. Sorry guys I got sort of long winded but one thought leads to another and you know. LOL.

Tom Greb

Tom...I wish I can convey my thoughts like you on "paper." You said it perfectly...Thanks for adding to our conversation.

Well its a forum so people are going to have different thoughts,opinions,etc,Now the way you exsplained the fever thing i understand,before i was saying a reptile could give its self a fever cause it gets it heat from its surrounding plus there cold-blooded,and do not have a consistent body temperature.Now if you call me having a different opinion calling somebody out so be it.And if i came off that i was being alittle argumentative well sorry,but again if i have a different opinion well its a forum there going to be different opinions.

Russet77....thats OK. As long as we all stay respectful when we present our conflicting ideas. I always encourage respectful (although it can get heated...lol) discussions of different opinions on care of our beloved reptiles. I have memories of our heated discussions of everything reptiles with my still best friend Mark Mitchell DVM (he is now an exotic vet med professor at U of I.) It was one of the best times of my life. Back in the early 80s there wasn't too many good information out there and we were coming up with new ideas that we bounced off and challenged each other with. For me, I always respect and listen to "the experts" that came before me but I will not take their word without testing them and apply to my situation to come up with what works for me. There are so many "blind following of the experts" out there and I do not believe in that...especially this expert aways have not nice things to say about other people and keep pointing out to us how he is the expert. I have much respect for people like Philippe DeVosjoi and late Bert Langerwerf as they always shared their expertise without a bad word for others or their competitors.

I also want to point out that we don't always learn from the experts: i can't count the times when i have learned new and better things from people just starting out.

Yeah ur right even exsperts arent always right either.Its funny u said Bert Langerwerf,honestly i knew him myself i use to keep tegus for about 9 years i bought tegus off him very nice guy and use to talk to him threw email off and on.But this is the best forum when it comes to cyclura iguanas,very helpful and smart people.

Sad about Bert, he fought that cancer like a champ. he spent a week with me at my farm about a month before he passed and his spirit was indomitable. He bought me a bucket...yes a bucketful of roaches as present...lol. Miss him terribly. Even he and i did not agree on everything but my respect for him will never diminish.

What a guy. I first met him back in about 87 I think just a couple years after he moved here. I used to try to talk to him on the phone but as we all know he was tough to understand and he was hard of hearing of course. He invited me down to his place and it was in early December. I remember it was like 45 F out and he had this huge enclosure for sungazers. These things were out basking at these cold temps. I just couldn't believe! He really broadened my horizons when it came to keeping lizards. Man how we argued how I was wasting my time keeping tropical reptiles when I could keep temperate stuff and save hundreds on my elelctric bill. LOL. Yes we all know Bert as being very frugal but his frugality was just plain smarts! He used to make enclosure drawings and notes for me so that I could keep stuff like russian torts(but only from the northern locale) and certain lacerta species and later Argentine tegus outside all year in Michigan. Unfortunately my interest did not lie with those animals. He just could not understand that as his interest was in all reptiles. I got to spend a lot of time with Bert as I moved to Tennesee and was within driving distance of him. Spent the 2004 hurricane expo with him helping him at his table-what an experience! Of course his taste in the folk music he loved so much wore off on me a bit. My wife thanked him for that! LOL. Yes Ty and Russets very sad that he is gone but he will never be forgotten! There will never be another Bert! And Ty, tell Lindsay hi for me. You took my uromastyx buddy! I can't call him and talk uros for hours now. Don't get around so much these days as I have a big family now and it is just not that easy to get away but hope to meet you one day.

yeah you described him in a nut shell. in many ways he was misunderstood as someone who gave bad customer service. what they didn't understand is how intellectual and busy he was and he had no time to chat with all the people who wanted his time. It was just him and Hester running that place!!!! Yes, Lindsay has been great and as he gets more comfortable running my farm, i plan on doing more travel so its all good. its nice to have a manager living on the farm. you can always call him and talk as much as you want with him on Saturdays between 10:00 to 10:05 as thats the only time he won't be running the farm for me...lol. He is free on most weekend so you should call and chat with him then, although he is impossible to get a hold of sometimes...i am wondering if he is allergic to technology such as phone...haha. anyways i think we should stop talking about personal things that other people are not interested in on here. you can get my email through Lindsay if you want to communicate further.

.

Too many variables. Take your heat gun and some body shots and if it's around 105 your probably good as long as there is a cool side. If you take your hot spot and change the color of the surface, you get a new temp. When it's 70f outside my lizards body is around 100f, the ground is close to 80f.KB