Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hello all. New to the forums and I can tell I'm going to learn a LOT from you all and I'm glad I found this website. My partner and I bought an Andean milksnake in late May 2013, complete with stand, vivarium, cypress bark chips, two hiding spots and so forth. The tank measures 36" wide, 18" deep, 18" high. He's about 4.5-5 feet long, and I believe he's 3 or 4 years old, though I'll need to double check. From what I've read, Andean milksnakes aren't the best choice for a beginner hobbyist due to their montane habitats. Nevertheless, he's been really good to us except for recently.

He's been a good eater, eating a large mouse twice a week (that was the feeding schedule that the pet store owner had him on; and for those curious, we got him from Fauna in NYC). We went through his first shed without any problems, however, for the past 2 to 3 weeks he won't eat. We take him into another, smaller tank (10 gallon if I remember correctly) and feed him a pre-killed, thawed mouse, usually around sunset or shortly thereafter. He will usually go for the mouse within 15 minutes, but lately, he won't go for it. He'll actually sit there and stare at the damn thing for about 20 or 30 minutes and not budge a millimeter.

Thus, why I'm here.

His tank conditions are:

Temps: warm side (88.2*F), provided by a UTH, and supplemented with a basking light (only on recently because of how chilly it has been). The cool side I don't have a reading; I'll be getting a thermometer sensor ASAP.

Furnishings are usual water dish, branch to climb on, a plastic plant for hiding in (which he's in right now), and a hideaway thing that you put sphagnum moss in, and substrate is Reptibark by ZooMed. Other than not eating, he looks relatively healthy, and I've seen him drink once during this time. Behavior wise, he's not acting unusual - he'll spend most of the day in one of his hides and will only be super active at dawn/dusk or at night.

Any ideas as to what might be the cause of his hunger strike? Your patience and guidance are very much appreciated!!

I believe your big problem actually lies in the temperature on the opposite COOL SIDE. And this is because they do NOT do well in warmer conditions due to their natural high elevation montane habitat in the Andes mountains.

Yes, it can always be okay for them to utilize a small warmer area on the opposite side as they see fit to thermoregulate,but they and L.t.gaigeae due fine with ambient cooler temps of around low to mid-70s or so. They will not do well at all in constant temps in the 80s and above whatsoever.

I think if you chech the temp with an accurate probe or temp gun on the opposite side of the heat, you;ll find it is far too warm. And this makes sense since it is well into the heat of the summer now.

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com/index.htm

Hey Doug,

Thanks so much for the info - I moved the sensor to that side of the tank and it's registering - so far - 77.2*F. I'll wait until morning and report the new temp, but ever since I turned off the basking light (and kept the UTH on), he seems pretty good. Time will tell though.

CJ

Sure thing man. We'll hope it drops a bit more by then and see where where your temps stay between. All of this depends on different factors of cage size, ventilation, outside enclosure ambient temp, and so on. So everyone's setup and conditions can be quite different when trying to achieve the very same outcome.

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com/index.htm

So Doug (and Joe), if the other side is too warm for being the cool side (which I saw was 75 this morning), how should I make it cooler for him? I've heard of people putting cloth covered ice bottles on the cool side to keep it colder, but I think that is slightly impractical... Maybe change the water or add ice to his water dish to cool it down?

Thanks

Chris

Reduce the heat some under your warm side by doing whatever you have to do (raising up slightly, etc...). That will leave very acceptable temps on both sides. Remember, they don't need (or even like) the higher temps that other lowland tropical subspecies such as hondurensis, stuarti, polyzona, etc...can. A thermogradient is fine, but the andesiana MUST be able to seek cooler temps when it wants to. Ironically, thermo-gradient choice is optimum for every snake enclosure. Heck, if you had a bin that was 20 feet long, you could have it freezing on one side, and scorching on the other. ........It's all relative.

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com/index.htm

Frozen water bootle wrapped in a cloth - not all that impractical.

You really need cooler temps, but it does not have to be 24 hrs. Even 4 hrs of cooler temps is better than none.

Cage on the floor is one way to help. A piece of granite tile inside the cage will stay cooler than the air. The frozen water bottle will keep the surrounding substrate cooler than the air for quite some time. Snake won't freeze - they are better than that.

Finding a room if possible that faces North or East helps too.

Might as well turn all heat off this time of year.

Thanks MarkG for the advice. I'll definitely get a frozen bottle in there once I get one... Our apartment faces west, and due to how our room is at the moment - and the fact that we didn't plan on having a snake when we signed the lease for the place - we unfortunately have his tank in front of the one window that faces west. I have a window fan there now, but once I get paid I'm getting blackout curtains for that window and keeping it shut.

I agree with Doug on the temps. He may be going into shed again, in which case it would not be uncommon for him to go off feed. You can also cut back on feeding twice a week and try once every 7 to 10 days. I had a Honduran go nearly a year without eating and he is still around and eating well. While that's not ideal, I say it to let you know that 2 or 3 weeks isn't a big deal yet.

Good Luck!
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Thanks!

Joe Exposito

Very much agreed, Joe. Regardless of what the fasting might be due to, it sure as heck ain't going to starve to death anytime soon..

cheers, ~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com/index.htm