Posted by:
FR
at Sun Jan 20 08:57:38 2008 [ Email Message ] [ Show All Posts by FR ]
The reason I cannot finish your posts is, You have a giant stumbling block and you refuse to look at it. So the rest of your thread is worthless.
The first thing you have to understand is, THESE are reptiles, as reptiles, they do not have a constant body temp. That is their advantage. anytime a reptile is not doing something important to its life, it conserves energy(by lowering its body temps from seeking lower ambient temps. They do that at any and all times of year. Not just winter or summer
(to hibernate, is to lower body temps in winter. To brumate is to lower body temps in summer), instead its linked to function. If they have the resources to function, they do not conserve/hibernate/brumate, they instead, LIVE THEIR LIFE. If conditions fall below whats needed to successfully function, they conserve(wait out poor conditions).
So you say you have males that choose to hibernate. Let me see, no food, no females, nothing to do, WHAT THE HECK DO YOU EXPECT THEM TO DO?
Heres the test and reality, you have snakes that are hibernating, I have the same types that are feeding and growing and will indeed reproduce. SAME SNAKES. I have montane and common kings(apples to apples)
Now consider, I also have the same species in another room(a room that gets cold) are not not feeding, Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. Heck, the rooms are seperated by 6 inches. So explain to me how its all about their behavioral need to hibernate.
Six inches seperates active snakes from inactive snakes. DUDE, its ALL about conditions. YOU have to support them to be active. YOU control the weather and conditions. You force them to hibernate, then say, SEE THEY HIBERNATE. I am trying very hard not to pick on you, but you should be able to see how I think its stupid.
Then you say, they have choices from 55F to 85F, who the frog droppings ever said thats a proper temp range, That sir, SUCKS and if thats all they had in nature, THEY WOULD CEASE TO EXSIST.
Try giving a range of 55F to 100F(small hotspot) You see, that is indeed the range most colubrids pick from. Of course its an average, as they will indeed choose both higher and lower.
Why I mention stupidity is, YOU(keepers here, not necessarily you) give them no choices to pick from, then say and think, that is normal
(stupid). ITs kinda like saying you, as in YOU, do not like to go outside. Well if you were living in a hut on the north pole and you were naked, of course you would not go outside. But if you were naked in Bora Bora, you would frolic naked on the beach. And thats the very same you. YOU ARE CONTROLLING THEM, they are not controlling themselves.
The above analogy sounds silly, but its dead on. YOU DO NOT PROVIDE the conditions to allow them to make, NORMAL NATURAL DECISIONS. Then you tell them that is what they are. Yes, I kinda think that is stupid of us(of all of us) to do.
So, I have a room with a number of snakes happily feeding like pigs, and I have several species of turtles laying eggs and I have monitors, laying eggs like pez despencers, RIGHT THE HECK NOW. and its mid January. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm I guess I don't get it, but indeed, I do get it, as I am recieving eggs NOW. hahahahahahahahahahahaha. Oh yea, these turtles are suppose to hibernate too.
Lastly please use some sense of humor, as its really not all that important to me, as I am not having problems or wondering about hibernation. If I want them inactive, I simply give them conditions to become inactive, if I want them to be active, I support that, if I want them to breed, then I support that. Its not about HIBERNATION or brumation. THOSE ARE SIMPLY BEHAVIORS TO WAIT OUT CONDITIONS THAT DO NOT SUPPORT LIVING. Which is a reptilian advantage.
Again, I am not picking directly on you, your just the one brave enough to have this conversation. And in that, I admire you. So please think about the animal, and not some stupid recipe for keeping snakes in tiny boxes. Out of respect for the animals(you say you love) think about them.
The reality is, the advantage of captivity is to not allow poor conditions, That is, in captivity they do not have to get too hot or too cold or be forced into inactivity. Or lack food, or lack water. Those are the things that force inactivity on natural snakes. We CAN AVOID THAT. hahahahahahahaha
The fact that folks(many) here do not have the slightest idea of what reptiles are, is very very very sad, specially after all these years of widespread understanding. Cheers
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RE: I finish yours, but OK... - FR, Sun Jan 20 08:57:38 2008