Posted by:
Bluerosy
at Sun Jan 20 10:40:05 2008 [ Email Message ] [ Show All Posts by Bluerosy ]
Zach:
Are some snakes more biologically programed than others to shut down their metabolism for part of the year? Maybe an eastern from NJ and an eastern from SC are really evolved to handle changing seasons very differently. Maybe they are more in tune to their outside environments... Maybe breeders in AZ or FL notice that their animals don't want to hibernate but in Vermont they do...hmmmm
FR:
ITs kinda like saying you, as in YOU, do not like to go outside. Well if you were living in a hut on the north pole and you were naked, of course you would not go outside. But if you were naked in Bora Bora, you would frolic naked on the beach. And thats the very same you. YOU ARE CONTROLLING THEM, they are not controlling themselves.
I think what Zack is saying that snakes kept outside of geographical ranges tend to do with whats going on outside (without actually going outside) irregardless of giving them selection.
FR:
So, I have a room with a number of snakes happily feeding like pigs, and I have several species of turtles laying eggs and I have monitors, laying eggs like pez despencers, RIGHT THE HECK NOW. and its mid January. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm I guess I don't get it, but indeed, I do get it, as I am recieving eggs NOW. hahahahahahahahahahahaha. Oh yea, these turtles are suppose to hibernate too.
Would snakes do this indoors if living on the north pole?
FR:
THOSE ARE SIMPLY BEHAVIORS TO WAIT OUT CONDITIONS THAT DO NOT SUPPORT LIVING. Which is a reptilian advantage.
But if snakes CHOOSE feed they will sit on the hotspot. If they choose to to eat they sit on the cool side and simply wait. For what?
FR
Try giving a range of 55F to 100F(small hotspot) You see, that is indeed the range most colubrids pick from. Of course its an average, as they will indeed choose both higher and lower.
Kinda hard to do in sweater boxes. Based on this i will go into my room and take accurate reading of temps of the snakes and their cool and hot end of encloser they are in. I will do this with a temp gun and post and try and adjust the temps as close as possible given they are in a small area..
I think the point that Zach was making is a snake will react to the conditions outside (based on where the snake is geographically) irregardless of the optimum conditions and selection of temp gradients. A keeper then sees this and turns down the temps because the size of a typical sweater box does not give the temperature gradient needed to make the snake cool enough to conserve its stores. It is more a practical thing because of the size of sterliet/rubbermaids most breeders keep them in.
Maybe this debate should be more focused on the size of the encloser (which i know has been brought up by FR before)than just giving opitimum conditions. But really knowbody know what eastern getula do underground in northern hemispheres in the wild. I really doubt that zonata eat lizards during the winter months even though they are in close proximity to them. So that means either A), the snakes can't get warm enough or.. B) they refuse to eat and choose a period because on there is nothing else to do (breed, lay, eat)and wait for spring. But why? If turtles will reproduce under optimum conditions why won't snakes do it underground all year long?
I am not siding either way as we have to do what works in capitivty. And that is to get snakes to reproduce in the most successful way possible..
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ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒE!
Bluerosy...who shamelessly takes every opportunity he can to post a picture of his Peabino.
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RE: I finish yours, but OK... - Bluerosy, Sun Jan 20 10:40:05 2008