Of snakes forming a bond of some degree.



This discussion is very important for the understanding of captive reptiles, but oddly, those against it are very focal and single minded. and normally newbies, you know, less then 10 years experience.



The actual point is, there are many ways to skin the cat, and each keeper is FREE to choose the method that suits them best.



This is the point missed. You are not forced to do anything you do not want to do.



THose of us who understand how to allow snakes to form pairs and colonies, also understand how to keep them singlely. And normally we do both. As nature does both as well.



Those that only understand how to keep them singely, have no concept how to house and maintain groups. Arn't you interested in learning????????



The odd part is, only those that do not understand how its done, preach their way as the only way. Under the cover of its safer for the snake. Which is simply not true.



The truth is, we can and do fail with any and all of these methods and the snakes are what suffers, they are the ones doing the dying. And not from one reason, well thats wrong, the one overall reason is ignorance.



Kingsnakes eating eachother in captivity is not high on the list of what causes captive deaths. No matter how its done.



But like all other deaths, it does occur.



Like with all other deaths, there are ways to prevent or lower the possibilities to a very acceptable level. That is true with all reasons for captive death.



The key here is, you do not have to avoid every little thing that has some possibility to cause harm.



Where we are failing in our understanding is, the snakes are designed to lower their own chance of failure. Both physically and mentally.



In the case of groups and bonding, its not as much physical, as it is behavioral.



All these species are nothing more then bags of material driven by behavior. Ethlogy.



Let me use a recent post as an example, Paul L,s post.



He stated the number of individuals of a couple species he observed in nature this year. Understanding those numbers, one then understands that Paul, keys on behavior to find these animals, and my bet is, he did not find them singlely, but instead in groups or colonies.



A number here, a number there, etc.



By understanding behavior, he understood where and when these animals would be, in order for him to observe them.



Depending on what part of the country you live in, there are species known to occur in large numbers. Like rattlesnakes, or ringnecks. From the mid U.S. east, its very easy to flip a board and find numbers to dozens of ringnecks under one piece of ac.



what is not thought about or considered is, ringnecks consume other snakes.



One well known poster, posted a series of pictures showing a regal ringneck killing and consuming a kingsnake, hahahahahahaha a pyro.



other areas of the country they find boas, both rosys and rubbers, in fairly large numbers in a fairly small area. One I have seen five times now is Coachwhips in congregations. Another snake eating species.



In a post below, I stated that its common in the spring(sometimes fall) to find two or more kings under AC. Sometimes a fair number. One person replied that they were there to avoid predators. What that poster missed was, if they consumed eachother, they were eachothers predator. So that did not explain why they were in the same spot, and not in the act of eating eachother.



When I lived in Fla, one fella found 118 fla kings laying out together. Ok, I have never seen those numbers, but groups were possible to find.



To make it clear, there are field reports of groups of most species of kings being found in nature.



Understanding behavior is important, To form a pair or group, herd, swarm, school, flock, den, is to include members and to exclude members. Just like clicks here and everywhere, to include and to exclude, go hand in hand.



In captivity, there are indeed methods that allow our captive kingsnakes to include other individuals of the same species, or even other species. To a point of living together on a daily basis without interference such as removal feeding. Which to me is silly.(but thats another whole thread)(if you have to remove a neonate to get it to feed, it tells you something is wrong with its cage)



Why those opposed this will not discuss it, how its done, what causes it, what causes it to fail etc, is about them and not in the interest of education.



The tactic of making it about RIGHT or WRONG, does not apply and is only a tactic of debate. So these folks make it about right or wrong, they try to dicredit, etc etc in order to cover their own insecurities.



Which means, why can't you folks talk about the hows and why, it can be done by folks like Bluerosy or I(and others) WITHOUT problem.



Its not that you have to do it, no one is forcing you, SO why the holy heck do you oppose it so violently.



This is a discussion board, in this case we want to discuss this subject, not participate in the forming of opposing groups. Or bonding with eachother. Thanks

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