Wow, lots more things to think about.



First, I am not a believer that snakes eat snakes, hahahahahaha what a dumbbell. Ok, lets take kingsnakes, if kingsnakes ate kingsnakes, there would be one giant kingsnake, get the picture, what is better at finding a kingsnake, then another kingsnake. Yet, lucky for us, there are still lots of kingsnakes, so whats the deal?



Tom, you are the perfect person to test this. I mean perfect, that is other then me. Or better yet, other then I use to be. I use to feed the hell out of snakes, had them grow giant and produce like crazy. You still do that hey? I didn't stop doing that for any reason, I just got tired(old)



So you understand how much kingsnakes can eat. Remember that.



Heres the test, take one clutch of kings, you know, something like cal kings(thats what I tested) and keep them in the same cage, feed them as often as the will eat. Call that group A. Now take another clutch of kings(easterns, hahahahahhaha, naw, another group of cali's) and keep them in one cage. Feed them once a week. Call that group B. Then take another clutch and feed them once every two weeks. Call them group C. When feeding take each out and feed in a deli cup. and wait at least 30 minutes before returning to the cage.



Now measure the results. Which group has the most cannibalism.



What you should see is, they will only eat eachother when starving. Consider, there is a difference between hungry, really hungry and starving and starving to death. In the last case, starving to death, kingsnakes from the same clutch will indeed consume eachother. But not kingsnakes that are only hungry. I imagine, they would normally go find food when hungry and not allow themselves to starve. But we as keepers do not have handle on what is hungry or starving, we only understand schedules, which have nothing to do with how hungry a snake is.



Now after your third group has turned to poop, try part 2 of this test. Place one individual from group B into the box of group A and see what happens. You can also put one from group A, into groups Box's box. What you will see here is, the intruder will be consumed in minutes, even without starving. Now do it all over again to make sure its relible.hahahahahahahahaha



And yes, I did indeed test this many times. What else was I going to do with all those dang cal kings.(all those first five hundred hets)



So no, I do not think snakes at a den eat eachother, unless they are in drastic circumstances. I think babies do not normally go to dens, or they congregate in different areas, but most likely stay where they are. I have seen several lizard species that congregate by size and age.



As you know, for the last 14 years I have been working with varanids(monitors) they behave much like colubrids only on massive speed. They do the same things only many many times faster. They are a better test subject. I can strave a juvi to near death in four or five days.



Both kingsnakes and varanids recognize third own, whatever that means, family group, same clutch, or local population. Call it the same tribe if you will. They normally do not consume members of the same tribe or group. But will readily consume "others"



Back to snakes, HMK and I routinely find males in close proxcimity. We did just a few days ago. But we never find them combating. So who the heck are they combating? other males? what other males? males of a different group possibly?



I think thats what they do. To test this, you can raise several males together. Then after they mature, place a different male in with them and see what happens. Results are, when raised together, they do not combat(normally) but as soon as a "other" is introduced, they will combat the beans out of it.



So the above suggests that snakes form a relationship, even males and treat members of their own, differently then they treat "others".



So you see, I feel your very interested in this, you can do captive tests that can reveal and expose behaviors that occur in nature. There are indeed captive ways to compare natural snakes to captive snakes. OK, this was too long and only covered a little of your questions, ask again and only ask one question, hahahahahaha FR

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