Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I have two red foots for about two years now. One is a male and looks really healthy and the other is a female and has not grown at all since I got her. She also has always had really dry skin and is really small! I took them to the vet and the vet informed me that the male was only about a few years or so old and the female is closer to seven or eight years old. The vet also said that she thought the female was malnourished as a juvenile and will probably never grow, but besides that they both looked healthy. I keep their humidity at about 80 percent and feed them a variety of foods (they both eat like pigs and are fairly active). My question is this: Do you really think my female is healthy? She looks so pathetic and dry compared to my other red foot. I attached some pictures so you can see how small and dry she is. Also, i added some of my male so you can see how different they look. The vet was definitely not an expert on tortoises (we live in a VERY small town) so let me know what you think. sorry the pictures are so big...i dont really know what im doing.

Thanks!

Here is my big healthy male:

My male with my little female:

how small she is:

and her dry skin:

I think your female may be a cherryhead. If you post a pic of her plastron it would help. If she is eating and moving around like the other one I wouldn't worry. Do you soak the torts?

Your vet does not seem to know what he is talking about. I may be wrong, but it is my understanding that torts continue growing throughout their life and just slow down as they get older. I am interested in how the vet knew how old your torts are. They both look fairly young to me.

thanks so much for responding! It seems like the people on here really know what they are talking about..which is EXACTLY what i am looking for!! Anyway, I do soak them. i try to every day, but honestly probably only 5 days a week....proably 30 minutes each soak, or until they poo. They do have a shallow water dish in their cage that they can go into if they want (but they never do..not even to drink, they just wait unitl i give them a bath). Like i said, i live in a small town and the vet is by no means a "specialist" so ANY advise would be greatly appreciated. The only way i have learned has been by internet research and (sad to say) trial and error. i added some more pictures of the female. Hopefully it helps? THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!

Yep, your little one looks like a cherryhead. The bigger one may be a girl. They are a bit small to really sex them accurately. How big are they actually? Where do you live? What is the ambient outside humidity, temp etc?

The little one is about 4 1/2 inches in length (and has not grown even an inch in the past two years) and the larger one is about 7 inches…and it seems like it is growing by the day!!!
I live in Eastern Washington and it is a high desert climate. Obviously I keep them inside, but I do have a hard time keeping their humidity perfect. I have managed to constantly keep it between 70 and 80 percent, but vary rarely do I get it any higher then about 87. I mist several times throughout the day with a really cool mister that works well and I have a small pool of water for them, but the air is so dry here that it is a never ending battle. I also use two heat lamps at night. I put one 75 wat on the warm side and one 50 wat on the cool side. I also have a uv lamp that I turn on during the day (along with one heat lamp… just to be sure the temp stays high enough).
Overall, they love to sun bathe and spend quite a few hours just laying out on their sun rock soaking up the rays. Like I said, they eat like pigs. I often let them run around in my yard or around my house (supervise of course) and they are just like little tanks running all over and taking out anything in their way! Although the little one is very active and eats well she just does not look right to me and the more I really research red foots the more worried I become. She just seems so crusty and discolored compared to the other one.
Thanks for letting me know she was a cherry head. Could this have something to do with why she looks so pathetic compared to my regular red foot? Is it ok to keep them caged together? Do cherry head require a different diet or climate then a regular red foot? They seem to really like each other and always sleep/eat/ walk around together (you can’t find one with out the other). Also, if you know of any good websites that have credible information, I would love to check it out. It seems like everything I read contradicts itself and it is somewhat discouraging. I just want to be the best tortoise owner that I can…but I think I need a lot of help. I’m in a bit over my head.

Both of your tortoises look fine. It is strange that the smaller animal (the cherry-head) has grown so little over the past few years. Has it really not grown at all? What was its length and weight when you obtained it? What are these measurements now? Slow growth I can understand, as some tortoises simply grow more slowly than their fellows. However, no growth often means a failure of development (which is unheard of in animals so large as yours; it is typically a condition of hatchlings and similarly young juveniles). It is obvious that your smallest animal suffered a substandard diet prior to your obtaining him/her, but I have seen worse. It certainly wouldn't cause a continuous lack of growth, though. Competition can have something to do with it as well. Do you notice the larger tortoise crowding the other away from foodstuffs. Does he/she sit on the food while eating, preventing the other from partaking in the feast? A friend of mine has a 1.4 group of Venezuelan red foots, and the largest female of the group engages in this greedy behavior, making it necessary for him to offer food to the tortoises individually (i.e. keeping three to four different substrate-free feeding areas). Even this, at times, does not keep her from trying the tactic. Anytime she sees another tortoise taking a bite of something, she has to rush over, squat over the food, and have at it when said tortoise retreats.

Your tortoises don't drink from their water bowl, which is not at all uncommon. I find that many times, redfoots kept indoors tend to form routines around soakings. Also, the warm water is that much more attractive than the room temperature offerings of the sitting bowl. Your misting routine is also probably contributing to the seeming refusal of drink from the water bowl as well.

Ultimately, what it really comes down to is whether or not the animals are eating, whether or not the animals are active and alert, and whether or not they are free from injury or visible symptoms of illness or deficiency. If your tortoise has been in exceptional spirits and livliness for the past year, chances are it will continue to be this way lest some accident or new arrival puts this in jeopardy. I've never kept cherryheads, so I'm not certain of any diseases that can be transmitted between these animals. Chances are, as said previously, if they've been together this long and there are no problems, there probably won't be any. Redfoots are hardy tortoises, and I've never known one to succumb to a respiratory illness (or any illness, for that matter) following exposure to a different species of tortoise. That being said, I wouldn't go taking any chances with new tortoises, not even other redfoots, at least not without a proper period of quarantine. Redfoots tend to be inquisitive, and this is often mistaken for friendliness, but I would describe it more as a nonaggressive curiosity.

From the description of your care regimin, I would say you're doing just fine. Keep up what you're doing. Post up details should either of your animals suffer a decline in health.

T.G.

Go to Redfoots.com and he will give you all the help you need. Also there is a post that will show you the difference between a Cherry Head and a Regular Redfoot. This is the post, but I don't know if I am posting it right.
http://redfoots.com/smf/index.php?topic=483.msg2916#new
Copy and paste it and hopefully you will get it and see the pictures.

I agree 100%.

yeah..she REALLY has not grown AT ALL in the 2 years i have had her. Her weight has stayed exactly the same too...poor girl

Well, those redfoots are tough little buggers. What are you feeding them? How often?

i have been feeding them many different things. They get a lot of mixed greens (spring mix letuce, brocoli, green beans, avacado, zikini,..exc. I also add in squash, shreaded carrot, and mushrooms. They also LOVE tomatos and bannana but i heard those are not good for them...so i keep them to a minimum. I mix up the foods that they eat so that they get some variety.

I have this calcium mix called "tortoise dust" (it has some protein in it too) that i sprinkle on top of their food.
...i did buy that pellet tortoise food a few months ago and they LOVED it, but then i read online that it is not good for them...so i stopped.

any other suggestions?

I'm not too sure on some of the thing you are feeding your tort. Like avacado, I've never thought of that, but I know for people it is fattening. I am not too keen on zuchini, green beans or broccoli either. I don't know if those are per se bad or good.

I prefer to feed mostly filler greens like red leaf lettuce, romaine, green leaf lettuce, dandelion, cactus pads and fruit and hibiscus flowers and leaves. For fruits I feed, papaya, melon (whatever is in season), strawberries, mushrooms, banana (occasionally), apricots, peaches, plums, nectarines, mangos (when I can pry them from my husband) and grapes. Bananas are fed very sparingly here too. There is much more other random things I throw in but this is what is the easiest to get in the local fruit market here. What ever is in season is what I feed. I know there is alot of info out there and everyone has different opinions especially about what to feed the torts. Take it for what it is worth and try different things. I prefer the filler greens and the softer fruits.

Thanks for the advise. It is often hard to get decent fruit year round in the town im in. I do feed grapes often and strawberries too. They are not into cactus or dandalion, but that is just about the only thing they will not eat. I will start giving a bit more fruit. I would say their diet consist of about 65-75 percent lettuce (a viariety of different kinds that i get in a mix) right now. Do you think it should be more?

thanks again!

The easiest thing you can do if you have a yard is plant a few hibiscus plants. Mine love the flowers and the leaves. I am very liberal with my feeding schedule for the adults. Usually they get fed fruit every two or three feedings, they get fed everyday and they get fed alot (they are quite greedy little buggers). If I am out of fruits then they get 3-4 days of greens. I am a firm believer in variety. Who wants to eat the same thing everyday? The hatchlings I am a bit more strict and on schedule. I feed them every day. Three feedings of greens to one of fruit. They are also loving the hibiscus and flowers. Surprisingly they also like the cactus and the cactus fruit.

Everyone has different opinions of what to feed and how often. I feel as though they should get fed daily. If they were in the wild they would eat when they are hungry and stop when they are not. I do know that I am lucky in that I keep mine outside almost all year round and the weather is suitable for the redfoots (i.e. high humdity and heat). It is alot easier to clean outdoor pens than indoor ones!

ohh i forgot to mention the little ones pyramiding. I dont think that it has gotten any worse sence i have had her, but she does have quite a bit and her shell is more grey then black. My larger one has no pyramiding and a very dark shell. Im not sure if this is really useful information, but just thought i would let you know.

Thanks SOOO much!!!! My tortoises will love you for all the help!

ps....THe Cherry Head had a really red nose ... like a bulb on it. Like Rudolph . lol