Reptile & Amphibian Forums

OK, so this is baffling to me. I have a female boa, 1 female corn, one suspected female corn and one female ball python that have regurgitated. All have been fed thier normal size rats, nothings changed that i can tell. im using the same feeder source so whats the deal? there are males in all of the tanks and all of them i think are breeding age, i know the corns are. not sure if they are breeding though. would this be a breeding thing? my other female ball that is breeding has had no problems
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Owner of:
6 ball pythons
2 red tail boas
4 leopard geckos
2 crested geckos
3 iguanas
3 bearded dragons
6 dogs
16 cats
6 hamsters
RIP:
Rocky-chow mix-11 years
Willow-lab mix-8 years
Kain-Savannah Monitor-2 years
Scooter-sulcata tortise-1 year
Mr Krabs-hermit crab-5 years
Niko-gerbil-3 years
sweet pea&niblet-dwarf hamsters-1 year
Hannibal-dwarf hamster 2 years
Scarlett- hamster-3 years
wicket-hamster-2 years
pixie- ball python- 3 years
Fira - Crested gecko age unknown
Star- rat- 3 years(we think)
squink- crested gecko- less then a year
stinky-snapper- age unknown.

I can't think of anything off the top of my head, but it might be as simple as the males chasing the females (or otherwise stressing them out) and causing the regurg not unlike how handling shortly after a meal does. Watch your temps, to hot/cold will promote regurgitation. Also consider a smaller meal size while the snakes are together should this be the cause.

Good luck,
Ian

My first question would be have you handled any type of reptiles from any other persons collection, or purchased and introduced any other reptile to your own collection in the last month or two? Also, has any one else that owns reptiles been to your home and handled any of your snakes in the last month or two?

Kelly

the temps are the same, the conditions with the males being in there is the same. the only difference is there are a few new ones. one of the corns was already doing this before. the boa has never had a problem and neither has the bp. and they arent puking right after, they wait a couple of days or even a week. i have never had this problem before even when i added new ones. the rats are usuallly partially digested, one was just the skin and bones there was no meat the boa could have been the temp cuz thier heat light got knocked off..they arent loosing weight so idk. with the corns, im offering smaller then what they eat anyway
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Owner of:
6 ball pythons
4 red tail boas
2 crested geckos
2 iguanas
3 bearded dragons
3 tokay geckos
6 dogs
16 cats
4 corn snakes
2 rat snakes
3 gerbils
RIP:
Rocky-chow mix-11 years
Willow-lab mix-8 years
Kain-Savannah Monitor-2 years
Scooter-sulcata tortise-1 year
Mr Krabs-hermit crab-5 years
Niko-gerbil-3 years
sweet pea&niblet-dwarf hamsters-1 year
Hannibal-dwarf hamster 2 years
Scarlett- hamster-3 years
wicket-hamster-2 years
pixie- ball python- 3 years
Fira - Crested gecko age unknown
Star- rat- 3 years(we think)
squink- crested gecko- less then a year
stinky-snapper- age unknown.

I see where Kelly is going with this, and it looks like you should have quarantined your new snakes. It is possible that you are experiencing the early outbreak of cryptosporidia or a disease with similar symptoms. Seperate all of your snakes, especially the animals that have yet to be exposed to a symptomatic snake. Take regurging or otherwise ill snakes to the vet, with a fresh fecal and freshly regurged prey if possible. Do not get any new snakes, or sell any that you have until you have figured this out.

Ian

This is a classic scenario for the indication of Cryptosporidia movement through a collection. While not a given, I would say it is extremely suspect. One characteristic symptom to look for, especially with the thinner corn snakes, is a mid-body swelling or lump. Another symptom is usually diarrhea, so that is something else to watch for. Crypto needs no intermediate host and the oocysts are extremely resilient and difficult to kill, therefore crypto can probably move through a collection easier than any other pathogen.

Ian is correct in that that all of your snakes need to be separated and quarantined and everything disinfected until it can be determined what’s going on here. Best to use a strong ammonia solution followed by a good rinse and then a strong bleach cleaning. Make sure to keep the bleach and ammonia separated. Buy some cheap latex gloves for cleaning and maintenance and change gloves when moving between snakes or cages. As Ian said, a vet can have a fecal sample checked for the crypto oocysts, although they can sometimes be difficult to locate even in an infected animal. Another interesting thing about crypto is that some infected snakes can be asymptomatic carriers, and these individuals may harbor the oocysts and can spread the infection to other snakes even when they don’t show any signs of the infection themselves. Let us know how the outcome of the fecal examinations.

Kelly

i see what you're getting at. but the thing is, i noticed the female corn doing it before the others came in. she has been in contact with the same snakes with no problems, the other male snakes who have eaten have not puked nor am i seeing runny poop or lumps. ive only noticed the 3 breeding females doing this so thats y i was wondering if it was a female or a breeding thing. the closest vet to me is about an hr away so i could either pay the vet bill or put gas in the truck, cant do both nor can i separate everyone. i dont sell my snakes nor do i get rid of them. if something changes i will figure out something
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Owner of:
6 ball pythons
4 red tail boas
2 crested geckos
2 iguanas
3 bearded dragons
3 tokay geckos
6 dogs
16 cats
4 corn snakes
2 rat snakes
3 gerbils
RIP:
Rocky-chow mix-11 years
Willow-lab mix-8 years
Kain-Savannah Monitor-2 years
Scooter-sulcata tortise-1 year
Mr Krabs-hermit crab-5 years
Niko-gerbil-3 years
sweet pea&niblet-dwarf hamsters-1 year
Hannibal-dwarf hamster 2 years
Scarlett- hamster-3 years
wicket-hamster-2 years
pixie- ball python- 3 years
Fira - Crested gecko age unknown
Star- rat- 3 years(we think)
squink- crested gecko- less then a year
stinky-snapper- age unknown.

Anytime a group of snakes starts regurgitating meals all around a similar time period, one of the first of several possibilities is a cryptosporidia outbreak. There are a few other things that could cause this, but crypto would be a common reason under this scenerio. Another possibility would be the feeders, but that seems pretty unlikely in this case. Temps too high or low could be a cause, but they would need to be way out of the range to cause what you have seen. A virus is also another possibility. Under your travel and caging conditions as you described, I guess you will just need to keep an eye on it and see how it goes. Please keep us posted.

Kelly

what travel conditions? i looked up what you said it might be and it said that they regurg 4 days or less after feedin and usually it was more then that. i will keep you posted, it could be temps as my room gets hot so i cut off the lights sometimes. the werid weather is driving me crazy. its possible it was the food source i am looking into all of your suggestions...would it be possible that since they are all females of breeding age that they could be pregnant and that its too much with the food and the babies? idk
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Owner of:
6 ball pythons
4 red tail boas
2 crested geckos
2 iguanas
3 bearded dragons
3 tokay geckos
6 dogs
16 cats
4 corn snakes
2 rat snakes
3 gerbils
RIP:
Rocky-chow mix-11 years
Willow-lab mix-8 years
Kain-Savannah Monitor-2 years
Scooter-sulcata tortise-1 year
Mr Krabs-hermit crab-5 years
Niko-gerbil-3 years
sweet pea&niblet-dwarf hamsters-1 year
Hannibal-dwarf hamster 2 years
Scarlett- hamster-3 years
wicket-hamster-2 years
pixie- ball python- 3 years
Fira - Crested gecko age unknown
Star- rat- 3 years(we think)
squink- crested gecko- less then a year
stinky-snapper- age unknown.

Gravid females usually go off feed, and the ones I've had that did feed never had regurges. You mentioned high temps; how high did they go? It would take temps over 95 to cause what you are seeing.

Kelly

Temp's over 95F, unless the entire enclosure is reaching this temp and the snake cannot cool off.

Kelly mentioned an asymptomatic carrier state of crypto (this can occur with many diseases). Often stress can instigate the disease to get a head up and the snake begins showing symptoms. This stress can be hibernation, breeding, change in husbandry, new additions etc.

Keep us updated, and good luck,

Ian

Thanks Ian, I should have clarified more. I was definitely talking about background cage temps over 95, and not even taking into consideration a hot spot.

Kelly