Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hi everyone my name is jeff im from omaha nebraska , I just wanted to come on here and introduce myself.... Ive been reading the forumn and cruising the site for a long time now and am ready for a post. First off alittle about myself. Im a huge pit fan...pretty much all i keep lol. Im a diesel mechanic/service manager and spend most my evenings repairing big trucks. I have a wonderfull wife and two girls... Favorite snake of all time is the louisiana pine followed by the bull snake. I always had a fascination with snakes, but where im from(inner city )there was only garter snakes, still i cought them everyday, measured weighed them and checked theyre health every day for years untill my early teens.... One day my best friend called me histerical and siad "jeff theres a python in my yard"...i bolted out of the house and down the alley faster than the flash to find a huge bullsnake in his yard already ticked off. If you can emagine my excitement finding this in the middle of a big neighborhood very far from any parks or even fields for that matter. I was blown away ( I think i was prolly 12 years old at the time ) anyway i wrangled that beast by hand by myself.... The size, attitude and striking distance were nothing that i'd never seen outside of a book.....i was in love instantly and have ever since loved the pits haha. Fast forward to 2 years ago, i finally settled down and now have a house of my own so mom and pops cant tell me no snakes in the house lol even though the wife doesnt like it...she supports me. Anyway i really dont have any close herp friends and everything I know (or think i know) is from the countless hours of reading and searching pictures.... Soooo This forumn has been a little slow so to keep it going i though i would ask a few questions. First thing i want to know is where do the red phase northen pines really come from. I read somewere "jersey" wich may be but that is in my opinion way to big a place and an abused term....where in jersey? .... Next question, anyone know who keeps them, there pretty high on my want list. Third question what got you into snakes or even pits for that matter? I have so many more but i want to keep it light for now as i have a gabbed enough....hahaha let me know....sorry about the grammer me and my phone are being dumb right now. Also i will post some pics soon. Thanks!

Forum dont die on now! Anyone?... It is a tough question to answer if you dont know someone who knows enough about them to ask, theres very little info on non "jersey" northerns. Unless im not in on a source better than the pit page? Opinions and guesses accepted! and also i know someone HAS to know somebody who keeps a few......

Welcome to the Forum Jeff! In regards to the red Northerns, I really can't answer your question, I'm not sure if they are limited to a specific locale,or if they are just a random color variation that can occur within any given clutch.

hey thanks! its good to be on here. i've seen some of your pictures on here.......definitely a fan of your collection! anyway, the pit page describes it as a morph, i really just couldn't get past the thought that its a line trait.. much like a kingsville, i just pictured populations of them ya know! thnking now your prolly right and thats why the info isn't there...because the red never took off and got exploited through selective breeding...Right? thats a poss answer for sure! thanks again! wait wait what if no one has really tried and it is recessive..........now that would be neat.. i need to get my hands on some and make some improved rusty northerns! wahahahahahahahah.... 4th gen with good luck! right? ... haha or years of trying and no results is more like my luck haha anyone else got a theory or resalution?

Red Northerns definately are not restricted to the Jersey Pine Barrens. I've seen pictures of Georgian specimens, which were also quite red.

As for availability, I remember Cherryville used to breed Red Northerns, but I'm not sure if they still do. Í don't even know if they're still in business.

http://www.cherryvillereptiles.com/bull/red.html
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I'm Dutch. Somebody shoot me.

Thanks man! just the input i'm lookin for... i did read that about the ones found closer to the southern part of the range espescially the north/southern integrades have more of a red banding/marking..... i'm having trouble finding good pics online though... I want to know if the really red ones are random found or locale specific...the ones with the uniform red ground color! what are your thoughts on that?... is it a morph or line trait?

Well, they're not morphs since they do occur in the wild. It is a trait I believe would be suitable for line breeding, but I'm not aware of this ever having actually been done by anyone.
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I'm Dutch. Somebody shoot me.

yep that's what i'm thinkin too!... looking at photos on the net most of the ones i can find have cherryvilles name on them, and they are amazing! hopefully i can eventually work with some even half as nice as those! still though wish i could see pics of other reds and have some background to them.....

The late, great Lloyd Lemke used to breed them, but it's a moot point since he's no longer with us. That was in a time when people were getting out of Pituophis in droves... Couldn't sell their Black Pines let alone a few other noted subspecies. Bart Bruno might have substantial input regarding them, should he be monitoring. You'll see his name pop up here on occasion.

I don't know if this will help any, but back in 1990 I bought an albino northern from Glades Herp. They were still pretty new to the hobby back then. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the origional WC female came from New Jersey. Anyway I bred my albino to some normal females, and most of the offspring had alot of red. One of the females was black and white with no traces of red.

Thank you very much! i think it does help gain some ground here... also thanks to everyone else for the welcome and input...i think for sure now we can say its a variable just like many other reds....i've seen pics of wc nebraska bulls with more red tones than normal for the region, i think it is very uncommon though..... i want to say that it strengthens the assumption that there are also populations of much redder ones out there...again much like a kingsville! just maybe not so well known by a location name. but still not so sure on that one!.....pretty neat stuff how that pairing came out for you though!......not to get off topic here but in 1990 i was 8 years old, i cant imagine what it was like trying to trade and communicate back then. amazing.... much respect to the pioneers of these beasts and what they have done for all of us. my collection is there for me to see thanks to these guys and the generations they have given there hard earned knowlage and bloodlines too!...... i'm just learning things and raising snakes that someone else has already proved out with there own hard work! things can only get better from here!!!!!!... anyways....please everyone keep with the stories and if there are any pics of odd northerns ....lets see them!